KQo vs 4bet from bu

Joined: 05.08.2007

07.06.2013, 12:43 0

iPoker - $0.50 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 4 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (SB): 285.8 BB
BB: 123.36 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 20.90, 3Bet Preflop: 7.78, Hands: 829)
CO: 251.4 BB (VPIP: 24.47, PFR: 20.57, 3Bet Preflop: 10.03, Hands: 5,781)
BTN: 102.66 BB (VPIP: 22.46, PFR: 19.38, 3Bet Preflop: 7.12, Hands: 2,820)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K♣ Q♠

fold, BTN raises to 2.5 BB, Hero raises to 9 BB, fold, BTN raises to 20 BB, Hero calls 11 BB

Flop: (41 BB, 2 players) 2♦ 2♠ 3♠
Hero checks, BTN checks

Turn: (41 BB, 2 players) 2♣
Hero bets 21 BB, BTN calls 21 BB

River: (83 BB, 2 players) 3♦
Hero bets 244.8 BB, fold

Hero shows K♣ Q♠ (Full House, Twos full of Threes)
Hero wins 79 BB

He 4bets 20%, from BU, opens 50%. Since 50% range is 672 hands,
20% 4bet would be 134 hands, and if he stacks off TT+, AK range that is 46 hands, so it means that he folds to shove 66% of time, and I need with his 4bet size and my 3bet size around 50% FE to make it + EV.

So is it ok vs such a players to go broke 22-55, A2s-A5s, AQ+, TT+, and call him from time to time with KQ, AJ, 2 combos of KK and AA?

Since I saw him several times calling from bu with AA and other premiums so it means I can discard some percantage of 46 stacking off combos, so it means he folds around 65-75% to shove.

1) is this reasoning ok?

2) In a situations with hands which I call his 4bet, he still can go bet shove with TT+AK, but when there are no K, A on flop, he can go broke only with TT+, I block 3 combos of Q and K, so he is left with only 24 combos which could call me down here. So since his 4bet range includes 134 combos, and only 24 combos can call down, or call my shove after his cbet I think this is also +EV until he adapts.

My game plan is to shove after his cbet on flop on any board which is not Kx,Ax since his blockers hit it hard. I would do the same with KK, AA for balancing.

When he misses cbet, is it ok to bet turn and shove river since it looks like 99, TT, AK?

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3 replies

_Anonymous_

07.06.2013, 13:52 0

Hi,

Call is ofcourse fine, but if player is most likely 4-bet bluffing, then you should shove pre-flop, since you then always see 5 cards and getting to fold his Ax hands that are ahead
I would rather shove pre-flop A6s-ATs than A2s-A5s and I´m not really sure why you´re not shoving 66-99 if you´re willing to shove 22-55.
Against wide 4-bettor every pp is close to nuts, so I would rather shove them all and sometimes calling AA-QQ

In a situations with hands which I call his 4bet, he still can go bet shove with TT+AK, but when there are no K, A on flop, he can go broke only with TT+
I don´t really expect AK b/f too often on dry boards like 223 if you constantly c/rai against his c-bets , so I would not really going to c/rai most of the times at low boards

When he misses cbet, is it ok to bet turn and shove river since it looks like 99, TT, AK?
- I would never really expect you to have there AK, since you should shove that pf close to 100%
Sometimes maybe you can play pp-s that way, so trying him to fold Ax hands seems reasonable- problem is when he starts checking back big overpairs on paired low boards, but he would likely not take that line too often

best regards,

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GingerKid

Joined: 05.08.2007

Posts: 4,913

07.06.2013, 16:23 0

Originally posted by Kaitz20
Hi,

Call is ofcourse fine, but if player is most likely 4-bet bluffing, then you should shove pre-flop, since you then always see 5 cards and getting to fold his Ax hands that are ahead
I would rather shove pre-flop A6s-ATs than A2s-A5s and I´m not really sure why you´re not shoving 66-99 if you´re willing to shove 22-55.
Against wide 4-bettor every pp is close to nuts, so I would rather shove them all and sometimes calling AA-QQ

In a situations with hands which I call his 4bet, he still can go bet shove with TT+AK, but when there are no K, A on flop, he can go broke only with TT+
I don´t really expect AK b/f too often on dry boards like 223 if you constantly c/rai against his c-bets , so I would not really going to c/rai most of the times at low boards

When he misses cbet, is it ok to bet turn and shove river since it looks like 99, TT, AK?
- I would never really expect you to have there AK, since you should shove that pf close to 100%
Sometimes maybe you can play pp-s that way, so trying him to fold Ax hands seems reasonable- problem is when he starts checking back big overpairs on paired low boards, but he would likely not take that line too often

best regards,

I shove 22-55 because once he bluff catches me then I can expect him to call much wider, and I still have 75% value hands in shove range.
If I add 66-99, than I would have maybe too many low PP.

So you think it is better to shove all PP, and leave out A2s-A5s? I thought it is ok combinations 22-55, to show I have really weak PP, and A2s-A5s to show I have really weak Ax, so then people start calling more often AQ, AJ and I am ahead of that in most cases.

I guess people will adjust after some time, but I plan to analyse them more carefully by looking at pokertracker hands, and write notes about their behavior so I can readjust.

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_Anonymous_

10.06.2013, 08:02 0

Hi,

Likely I would rather shove pp-s, since then I´m flipping against AK.
With A5s-A2s you only have blockers to AK/AQ that might 4-bet/call and if getting called, then having around 33% equity.
Although 5-bet shoving always depends on the game flow and you can always mix up some random hands if you feel that player is going to 4-bet/fold most of the times.

best regards,

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