Skip to forum
Notifications
Clear all

So what do you do with this monsta!?

10 Posts
5 Users
1 Reactions
1,019 Views
WhiteWalker
Joined: 06.06.2015

MONSTA VALUE
Aims of this

Whats your play preflop?
How do you play flop? (check raising with this monsta draw)
Do you see the turn? Really?

Hello ladies and gents, this hand was interesting. I am wondering how to play this in different situations. So in this scenario action is given by villain thankfully, I am wondering what you do if you go to the turn. Are you check raising this draw on the flop, no c-bet? How large do you c-bet? Any opinions on this would be interesting, I just want to see how aggressive you would be.

PokerStars - $0.02 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha Hi - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

UTG: 183 BB (VPIP: 33.33, PFR: 3.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 30)
MP: 96 BB (VPIP: 100.00, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 5)
CO: 260 BB (VPIP: 32.63, PFR: 20.00, 3Bet Preflop: 6.67, Hands: 96)
BTN: 101 BB (VPIP: 20.99, PFR: 11.93, 3Bet Preflop: 1.25, Hands: 247)
Hero (SB): 80 BB
BB: 102.5 BB (VPIP: 32.94, PFR: 2.35, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 86)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K♦ A♦ J♦ Q♥

fold, MP calls 1 BB, fold, fold, Hero raises to 4 BB, fold, MP calls 3 BB

Flop: (9 BB, 2 players) T♠ Q♦ 5♦
Hero bets 5 BB, MP raises to 23.5 BB, Hero raises to 76 BB and is all-in, MP calls 52.5 BB

Turn: (161 BB, 2 players) 8♣

River: (161 BB, 2 players) T♣

Spoiler

MP wins 155.5 BB


Reply
Quote
9 replies
Padelbro
Joined: 21.01.2010

Pre-Flop is good pot-raise against limper-fish with very good hand.

Never go check-raise here with this hand as aggressor! The board is very dangerous and villain will check back a ton mediocre hands and draws that will pay you if you bet instead. You must also bet bigger, close to pot or just pot it. He is either going to call you or not to such board, regardless of the sizing and you want to build a big pot. You want him to draw and hit his hand, because then you hit bigger and get it all. Or if he doesn't hit, you have the best hand with AQ and get all that money he pays for drawing dead.

And when he raises you get it in fist pumping, you're ahead of top set here with this megadraw.

If villain just calls flop you keep betting big, or you can make it smaller if the board pairs or flush comes there OTT, just make sure you can get it in by the river.


Reply
Quote
WhiteWalker
Joined: 06.06.2015

Hey seagal, so you are bet, call. x/call, x/call? Is that not very passive when you consider I am ahead of top set. Whats your action on the turn then if you just call flop raise? Fold, I mean, I cann and there is 50bb left in to 59bb on turn. Villain is likely to put me all in on the turn even with a set considering the aggression of passive players when they see a good hand.


Reply
Quote
Padelbro
Joined: 21.01.2010

No, I said get it in, meaning going all-in.


Reply
Quote
Coach
Kyyberi
Joined: 09.07.2010

The important question is: what is his range on the turn?

If you think he has set always, then call his raise. If you think he has some draws in it, then shove.


Reply
Quote
WhiteWalker
Joined: 06.06.2015

Ah thanks Kyyberi, so you feel against a passive opponent who is most likely raising with sets and only sets (the majority of the time) therefore i cannot expect a fold with a small edge so should call to see a turn in which I can evaluate? Although there is no turn card in this spot that will affect my draw and I just move to 55/45 dog.

Is it to protect my play with top set in this spot v draws, balancing?

I guess if I am 50% on flop, 50% on turn then calling reduces my losses and means that in the long run I have +0 EV as it is a neutral spot but when I hit and a stubborn set calls off I get an extra portion of his stack which will be +ev for me.

All in OTF:
The pot is 161bb, I have 57% equity so I expect to have an expectation of +91.8bb (-rake)

Calling down to river/Getting it on the turn
This way would result in the pot being 56BB on the flop, with 52.5BB behind. This way if villain is spazzing out for some reason my draw has huge equity and could even potentially be best so therefore calling keeps more bluffs, if any in and I could have potentially picked up some fold equity v bottom set.

Either scenario I do not see me not getting it in considering how shallow I was but by flatting and getting it in on the turn I could keep a worse draw in the hand?


Reply
Quote
Padelbro
Joined: 21.01.2010

No. Only reason to just Call on the flop is that you can fold pairing turn cards, because you would be drawing dead then. I would not do it, because cannot be sure villain has a set, if he has QT and you fold turn 5 it's bad, or if villain actually has worse draw it's superbad. And also if you hit your flush, you need to donk shove and villain can actually make right fold then, even though it's very unlikely that he is capable to do it.


Reply
Quote
Coach
Kyyberi
Joined: 09.07.2010

The idea is that when you compare shoving the turn or calling, if you stack off on any turn the result would be the same as shoving the flop (as opponent isn't going to fold his set on any turn). Now if you can fold at least one turn card, it increases your EV.

It does backfire when

a) he doesn't have a set or at least 2 pairs with Q in it always.
b) he doesn't call your almost pot sized bet on the turn if you hit your hand.


Reply
Quote

I would c-bet the flop bigger...
Happy to get all the money in here vs most players on plo2.

Would it change anything if hero was 100bb deep?


Reply
Quote
Skodljivec
Joined: 17.12.2011

If you can get this in, do it. No reason to call and evaluate and stuff for the single reason that you might have the best hand on the flop since you completly crush any draw. You also block topset, and TT isn't really often in people's c/c ranges preflop so even assuming ever doing anything but pumping it in on the flop is bad.

If however you were up vs a nit and the board here was like T:d9:d5:h then you could potentially call a raise to fold a board pairing card on turns, but even then the play can only be made if you are damn sure he only raises T9+ on the flop and never a draw or something like KQJT.

Regards,

Skod


Reply
Quote