NL20 TP 3 handed OOP

What is the reason for the flop donk?

I would usually play this by check/calling flop and turn and check/folding river. Maybe even check/folding this particular turn would be better.

I see no reason to donk. I like check calling more too and as Alleen said maybe even x/f this turn.

Why wouldn't you guys donk ? I think I don't mind the donk. At least till someone will make clear arguments why is it bad. But I would bet little less. Like 2/3 max. Yeah, we need value and protection, but our hand is not THAT strong.

On the turn I would bet half the pot max. Check folding river I guess.

Originally posted by msnek
Why wouldn't you guys donk ? I think I don't mind the donk. At least till someone will make clear arguments why is it bad. But I would bet little less. Like 2/3 max. Yeah, we need value and protection, but our hand is not THAT strong.

On the turn I would bet half the pot max. Check folding river I guess.

I don't think donking is bad, it's just I very rarely donk heads-up. Actually, I think donking with TPGK might be a better option on that board than check/calling.

Originally posted by msnek
Why wouldn't you guys donk ? I think I don't mind the donk. At least till someone will make clear arguments why is it bad. But I would bet little less. Like 2/3 max. Yeah, we need value and protection, but our hand is not THAT strong.

On the turn I would bet half the pot max. Check folding river I guess.

Low limit regs tend to read donks as fish plays from fish that have weak hands. They incorrectly (given their reads) raise with suboptimal hands (essentially bluff catchers). This is why you want to donk with strong hands against these regs. Doing it with weak hands incidentally makes their standard play correct. This is why you should not donk, and particularly not pot-sized with this hand.

On a side note: The button played this perfectly. He didn't degrade into the low limit reg's standard behavior of raising the donk to the moon, and therefore extracted the most.

Originally posted by Alleen86

Originally posted by msnek
Why wouldn't you guys donk ? I think I don't mind the donk. At least till someone will make clear arguments why is it bad. But I would bet little less. Like 2/3 max. Yeah, we need value and protection, but our hand is not THAT strong.

On the turn I would bet half the pot max. Check folding river I guess.

I don't think donking is bad, it's just I very rarely donk heads-up. Actually, I think donking with TPGK might be a better option on that board than check/calling.

Ok, but why ?

Originally posted by YohanN7

Originally posted by msnek
Why wouldn't you guys donk ? I think I don't mind the donk. At least till someone will make clear arguments why is it bad. But I would bet little less. Like 2/3 max. Yeah, we need value and protection, but our hand is not THAT strong.

On the turn I would bet half the pot max. Check folding river I guess.

Low limit regs tend to read donks as fish plays from fish that have weak hands. They incorrectly (given their reads) raise with suboptimal hands (essentially bluff catchers). This is why you want to donk with strong hands against these regs. Doing it with weak hands incidentally makes their standard play correct. This is why you should not donk, and particularly not pot-sized with this hand.

On a side note: The button played this perfectly. He didn't degrade into the low limit reg's standard behavior of raising the donk to the moon, and therefore extracted the most.

I agree with everything you say. But I thought we think our opponent in this hand is more likely to be fishy than reggish.

Since it is obvious that villain holdings are far from nuts I would overbet the river. The only hand that I expect to call is JT - 8 combos and some occasional low flush. But he could fold AT, KT, 77, T9, 98 which are far more combos.

Originally posted by msnek

Originally posted by YohanN7

Originally posted by msnek
Why wouldn't you guys donk ? I think I don't mind the donk. At least till someone will make clear arguments why is it bad. But I would bet little less. Like 2/3 max. Yeah, we need value and protection, but our hand is not THAT strong.

On the turn I would bet half the pot max. Check folding river I guess.

Low limit regs tend to read donks as fish plays from fish that have weak hands. They incorrectly (given their reads) raise with suboptimal hands (essentially bluff catchers). This is why you want to donk with strong hands against these regs. Doing it with weak hands incidentally makes their standard play correct. This is why you should not donk, and particularly not pot-sized with this hand.

On a side note: The button played this perfectly. He didn't degrade into the low limit reg's standard behavior of raising the donk to the moon, and therefore extracted the most.

I agree with everything you say. But I thought we think our opponent in this hand is more likely to be fishy than reggish.

Right, that is a valid objection. I was referring to when I personally really like the donk, and that is for exploitative purposes versus regs that will misread it.

In this case (suspected fish that probably calls too much), I don't like it for the reason that it builds a big pot out of position with a very marginal hand. In fact, I'd use this argument against any opponent with this hand and this board. I am happy to just miraculously win a small to decent-sized pot. The flop is far from as good as it might appear.

Originally posted by msnek

Originally posted by Alleen86

Originally posted by msnek
Why wouldn't you guys donk ? I think I don't mind the donk. At least till someone will make clear arguments why is it bad. But I would bet little less. Like 2/3 max. Yeah, we need value and protection, but our hand is not THAT strong.

On the turn I would bet half the pot max. Check folding river I guess.

I don't think donking is bad, it's just I very rarely donk heads-up. Actually, I think donking with TPGK might be a better option on that board than check/calling.

Ok, but why ?

I think mostly because of protection. Our hand is not very strong and it's quite vurnable. There are alot of cards we won't like on the turn, either he bets or checks to our check. So, reasons would be protection, value and pot control.