K4s Iso-raise gets 3 callers...

K4s sounds indeed a loose iso and I would most likely fold right away. As played I would play the hand the same way. Maybe the river bet is to thin, but that depends per villain.

Cheers,
SDK1987

preflop is marginal, could be a fold, i dont know. on the river i might just check without reads

Interesting why would you check river, the villian shows weakness but might still call?

For the rest of hand I agree with the other two replies.

that is actually a very good question...

What is his checking range on the river?
I would assume something like: Tx,Jx,Qx, Kx, 2P.... Perhaps that he will check a set or a 98straight but I guess he shouldn't (ok in a GTO he should also check some good hands, but I do not give my opponents credit for a strong GTO game).

the question is if he would check sets, straights here, if so I probably would have to check. But what is the chance villain will check sets and straights?

i'd check river because there probably aren't many worse hands that will call. villain does show weakness, but our hand is also weak

btw if villain has a hand like a weak Qx, he probably should bet the river (as a bluff). Jx or weaker hands he shouldn't have in his range at all if he's playing ok

we can def say opponent isn't playing ok, he wouldn't openlimp in CO

I think we played the hand fine, the prob on the river is : what do we do if getting XR...we have to fold, but can we do it in real time?

K4s is def marginal isoR,

It is on the loose side preflop and OTR, but nothing blatantly wrong. Most fish will call that river bet with Qx and Jx (which is the reason they are fish:) ). Tis is 20c/Tc, so chances are he is a fish.

Oh, another thing. redskwerl's analysis demonstrates, as always, extremely clear thinking. But his opposition probably plays much, much higher, and are logical in their play. We other have fishier opposition and sometimes other plays are better versus it:D

Originally posted by MrT61
we can def say opponent isn't playing ok, he wouldn't openlimp in CO

I'm not convinced openlimping is that bad

hmm, it is not bad in it self, however you split you range further making reading your hand easier.

Originally posted by redskwerl

Originally posted by MrT61
we can def say opponent isn't playing ok, he wouldn't openlimp in CO

I'm not convinced openlimping is that bad

What sort of range would you consider open limping with, and why?

thats an easy1 ; in SH-play, there is no hand that fits an openlimpingstrategy

depending on the table you could think of limping premiums or SC hands.

Originally posted by MrT61
thats an easy1 ; in SH-play, there is no hand that fits an openlimpingstrategy

why, tough?

because other people say so

From a GTO persepctive it will split up your range alot! because you will split it very early you will be alot better to read on the later streets.

Originally posted by redskwerl

Originally posted by MrT61
thats an easy1 ; in SH-play, there is no hand that fits an openlimpingstrategy

why, tough?

That is a good question. I think that every play that carries a "stigma", like limping and donking, probably are bad, but nowhere nearly as bad as people might think. As I recall, even Cepheus does a small amount of open limping, and that is HU. Disclaimer: I haven't recently checked out on what Cepheus does, so I may remember wrong. But Cepheus once called me down with J high, so it has quite a wide variety of plays - all GTO.

sure, sometimes it can be ok to openlimp ( like it could be done with a low PP, knowing that other (bad loose) players can overlimp) ; But I think it is easier for people who are rather starting to play poker, to give some guidelines and starting from there.
Each rule has his exceptions, but we cannot learn everything in the same moment,
so, my starting point in a SH-FLHE game would be: no hand fits openlimping . Openlimping some hands will not make you a winning player when you are a beginner

probably true, however even beginners should at some point learn to play more than "easy" poker.

Thats true sailer, but is difficult to know where each of us stands "in their pokercareer".
What I wanna say is that in general openlimping isn't good, isn't the standard play , later on it can be ok with a minority of hands in certain situations.
The concept of openlimping will not transform us from losing into winning players.
Each rule has its exceptions