Huge Success In Poker - Hard Work vs. Natural Ability

I honestly think you can learn the game once you fully commit yourself. I can speak from personal experiance when i tryed to learn a dear friend of mine that it is impossible unless they fully commit.
Its always the wish of a fast income boost that prevails. But we all know it takes a lot more than just luck and muschle size.
But on the other hand i do not understand people playing Nl2 for two years.
To be really honest with you I think you need a good start, healthy bankroll and a good mindset.

Like anything in life, in order to be a top tier world class poker player you need to put in a ton of hard work, and have a killer natural ability.
I will admit that luck does also have a place. Eg: if you bink a large small stakes tournament you can move up stakes much faster, if you live in a city with very soft very big live games this may build your BR quicker, etc.

I agree

Hi

I believe close to 100% commitment and hard work can achieve anything, be it poker, chess, mathematics, biology, street sweeping.
You get out what you put in.

:-)

(now all I need to do is follow m own advice)

Originally posted by aXSesPSRNMD
Hi

I believe close to 100% commitment and hard work can achieve anything, be it poker, chess, mathematics, biology, street sweeping.
You get out what you put in.

:-)

(now all I need to do is follow m own advice)

+1

I am with you on this one.

Originally posted by aXSesPSRNMD
Hi

I believe close to 100% commitment and hard work can achieve anything, be it poker, chess, mathematics, biology, street sweeping.
You get out what you put in.

:-)

(now all I need to do is follow m own advice)

This! This ! THIS!

If you'll let me, ill use this as my signature.

I definitely agree with AxsesPSRNMDs post.

The thing I find with poker is, that even players who really want to work hard at it, don't understand how to. This is something I try to improve on. Like doing the hand reading game or plotting flops and calling ranges into flopzilla.

A lot of players wrongly assume that working hard at poker is playing a lot and reading forums a bunch, when the reality is more about sitting on your own reviewing hands and handranges and running equity calcs.

In actuality nobody knows the true answer to this.

People who reach the highest levels in this game probably have both a great deal of natural talent and also practiced (invested a lot of time thinking about the game/plays, etc) a lot.

If you are reasonably intelligent you can do fairly well in this game. However, I feel that some people would be forever terrible at poker.

Some of my friends simply don´t have the type of intelligence it takes to be a skilled player, just by the absurd stuff they say when we are having some sort of logical argument and they make statements that plain just don´t make sense, even though they think it does, it´s funny to watch.

So you are telling me anyone can be a grandmaster or get a phd at mathematics if decides to commit himself? Not really....

I think intelligence and talent is kind of overrated and it should not limit anybody. If someone is very intelligent or has very good analytical mind then its easier for him to master the game. but that does not mean that the one who does not have these abilities cannot be better someday. Like if you play 5h per day and study another two you can be super dumb and you will still be making big progress, even though the person with IQ 150 would probably need less time.

Imo the two most important things are just self criticism, and will to improve.

Originally posted by suaveplayer
In actuality nobody knows the true answer to this.

People who reach the highest levels in this game probably have both a great deal of natural talent and also practiced (invested a lot of time thinking about the game/plays, etc) a lot.

If you are reasonably intelligent you can do fairly well in this game. However, I feel that some people would be forever terrible at poker.

Some of my friends simply don´t have the type of intelligence it takes to be a skilled player, just by the absurd stuff they say when we are having some sort of logical argument and they make statements that plain just don´t make sense, even though they think it does, it´s funny to watch.

Please elaborate ♠_cool:

Originally posted by maythany

Originally posted by suaveplayer
In actuality nobody knows the true answer to this...

Some of my friends simply don´t have the type of intelligence it takes to be a skilled player, just by the absurd stuff they say when we are having some sort of logical argument and they make statements that plain just don´t make sense, even though they think it does, it´s funny to watch.

Please elaborate ♠_cool:

For example, where I live we have this local card game (which is not really played for money like poker does) it involves bets and raises in the form of points, but it doesnt work quite like poker.

At one instance I saw one typical play that the average player of this game does and I tried to explain why the play is not really logical: some player makes a strong bet trying to rep a strong hand, the other player is not really sure if he is bluffing or not but somehow raises his bet with a hand that should only be calling said strong bet.

I tried to explain that if you believe villain is bluffing but you´re not entirely sure and you have a hand that beats bluffs but doesnt beat legit strong hands you should only call his bet and not at all make a raise.

Their counter argument is "I think he is bluffing therefore I raise", certain that said argument makes sense, and my counter argument was like "you should only bluff a bluff if your hand is worse than his bluff and not turn a bluff catcher into a bluff". They seem totally unable to understand this reasoning, and keep on doing dumb plays like these.

I fucking hate said game exactly because there is not money involved, and as such and can´t punish people that make plays like that.

Average but hardworking always beats brilliant but lazy.

Originally posted by ursusmm
Average but hardworking always beats brilliant but lazy.

+1

Originally posted by Erevos
So you are telling me anyone can be a grandmaster or get a phd at mathematics if decides to commit himself? Not really....

At least for Phd yes everyone can do it.

Difference being that a naturally skilled person in mathematics will finish in 4 years, somebody who doesnt have that natural talent (like me) with hard work will do it maybe in 10 years

Just read this.

Originally posted by jbpatzer

Just read this.

Cliffs?

hard work is talent imo

Originally posted by maythany

Originally posted by ursusmm
Average but hardworking always beats brilliant but lazy.

+1

Thats what stupid ppl tell themselves to make themselves feel better

And very few ppl are ''average'', the fact is that 50% of them are simply bellow average.

And yes i do agree that Average/hardworking will always beat brilliant and lazy, but in poker terms, it takes more then average/hardworking to become Ivey, Galfond or Tom Dawn, those guys are all both brilliant and hardworking. It simply takes both.