Making a living with STT SNGs

Originally posted by tonypmm
Wp both. (I'd maybe 3x pre in the 1st one is the opp was tight-passive, which is not the case.)

I don't grind HUs as such, but as a 3-6-max SnG player, I have quite a lot of shallow HU play. Surely 6-max players are worse at HU, many of them play too many tables to get concentrated. My favourite reg villain in the HU phase is a Russian Pokerstrategist xvladislavx. (JP SnGs are a predominantly Russian game for some reason, there are at least 6 Russian (+1 Ukrainian) PStrat regs at Rios-Forts )

Yeah later on I saw you were giving him some advices on how to play HU in some treads ♦
He played really aggressive and was tough in the 1st game like I wrote. 2nd game he made a really wide call to 4 bet shove QJs (I had AJs) but considering our 3/4 bet dynamics he could have taught I am 4 betting there 50% or something ♦

In the meanwhile checked treads in your signature. It is hard to find real grinders here on poker strategy, glad to see you are very focused and dedicated towards your goals.
What is the average ROI pre RB on those jackpots 3-6 sngs? Do all the same guys play from 10 euro up to 50 or there is huge difference moving up stakes?
If you don't mind checking , I am interested in HU hypers traffic on Ipoker for 2.75 5.5 10-11 euro/$ limits. Especially in the morning like 10,11 am up to 3-4pm and are those full of regs that sit in the lobby or there is tons of fish?
I am asking all of this cause I am working on another way for my students since Microgaming traffic for 6 max is not that great, I might switch them to HU hypers + 6 max turbos (play in 2 different sessions different things until they get used to it to mix etc)

All the advices for Ipoker appreciated in advance man!

P.S. Agree with you about 6 max HU players. About 2 months ago I sucked in HU, sucked as in had 1st and 2nd very close to each other and there was tons of stuff that I didn't learn up until that point. Then spent a lot of time working on it since and now I have 3-4% more 1st then 2nd and on 15s Stars there is about 4-5 regs that I have really good dynamic and re-adjusting in HU, rest are very exploitable...

I've never really checked the traffic in HU turbos (a closer equivalent of Stars turbos than superturbos, the latter are a total lottery), which probably means they're too rare to grind...

I can't check in Euro mornings because I sleep then ♦, neither can I tell fast who're regs and who're fishes.

Regs don't block lobbies at these levels. Right now, at a semi-peak hour, there's only one €10 HUSnG of each speed going, 4 turbo €5s and 3 ST €5s.

Twister is where it's at. I think anyone who's good HU will be fine there, and the ease of getting multiple seats fast is comparable to Zoom.

Pre-RB winrates in JP SnG are smth like -10% for meh regs and -5% for crushers, because of the 14.5-15% rake. The RB for such grinders is 80%+ (12%+ in ROI), though

There are no €10 JP; all regs of €50s usually play €20s too because the traffic in the former sucks (there's just too little fish as opposed to €20s, like half a fish per table), or play €50-100 DoNs or 6-max supers.

Of course I can't assess attainable winrates in Twister just because it can't be tracked by result sites (it's even more covert than Zoom, no player names are listed in the 'lobby', you can't see them unless you're playing yourself).

My own Twister sample is yet too small, as I've been spinning the wheel only at the beginning and the end of JP sessions to keep the table count up, and of course I can't be viewed as a good example of a reg (I haven't checked the results lately, but I guess my Twister chip EV win % is less than 33).

Awesome info thanks a lot Tony

It sounds great that 5 euro limits have some traffic. I will consider moving my students to Ipoker to play 1 session of hu hypers at that limit or lower.

How does the whole twister work for HU? Basically you fold the hand and then you get new opponent and hand like zoom on stars right? Or is it totally different ?
That kind of thing HU will attract tons of aggression and action. I don't want my students to go crazy with that format just yet - still have a lot to learn regarding 4 bet ranges and post flop lines especially in 3/4 bet pots before they can dig into that
I will however consider registering on Ipoker and giving those a go ♦

It's not like Zoom. You tell the client to register you in a number of SnGs that you specify, without knowing opponents' names. Then you're seated (usually quickly) and play a 3-max turbo shortstack SnG (with antes) with all the same opponents until the end, so you can develop reads. The reason why I liken it to Zoom is that you can't select opponents like in a normal lobby, they're assigned quasi-randomly (you may of course guess that a regfish you've just finished off HU will register in a new one, and insta-press the register button yourself, like you'd press the rematch button, but you can't be 100% sure you'll be seated with him again).

Originally posted by tonypmm
It's not like Zoom. You tell the client to register you in a number of SnGs that you specify, without knowing opponents' names. Then you're seated (usually quickly) and play a turbo shortstack SnG (with antes) with all the same opponents until the end, so you can develop reads. The reason why I liken it to Zoom is that you can't select opponents like in a normal lobby, they're assigned quasi-randomly (you may of course guess that a regfish you've just finished off HU will register in a new one, and insta-press the register button yourself, like you'd press the rematch button, but you can't be 100% sure you'll be seated with him again).

This makes bum hunting in HU harder but with trick you shared it makes it possible
Also how many good regs are there on HU NL 50 really? Not many I am guessing ...

Alas there's no Twister above $10, though I've suggested adding higher limits to a Will Hill manager.

I know nothing about reg-infestation of iPoker €50 HUSnG, leave alone HU cash games.

There are quite a few regs in the $10 Twister, though. But yeah, normally it's 1.2-1.5 fishes per table (excluding myself). I can't tell how many of them are good because I can't yet classify regs that well.

Originally posted by tonypmm
Alas there's no Twister above $10, though I've suggested adding higher limits to a Will Hill manager.

I know nothing about reg-infestation of iPoker €50 HUSnG, leave alone HU cash games.

There are quite a few regs in the $10 Twister, though. But yeah, normally it's 1.2-1.5 fishes per table (excluding myself). I can't tell how many of them are good because I can't yet classify regs that well.

Appreciate it a lot man!
Checked Microgaming today, there was less traffic there compared to Ipoker so good to know all this info for future.

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77
Checked Microgaming today, there was less traffic there compared to Ipoker.

And there will be even less after Unibet launches a standalone platform on the 19th (combining it with the Micro network for a while at first). I can't really complain as I'll be on both.

So today I had very nice day overall!

1st thing, some clothes I ordered online with my brother arrived and they are great! Was really looking forward to them arriving but wasn't sure how they would turn out. Also I am now very much looking forward to future purchases online cause the prices are cheaper then shopping in malls or stores here in Nis. Wardrobe upgrade here I come ♦

Today I had 2 coaching sessions. Both of them were sweat and went really well. 1st one was with the best friend where he was 3 tabling and was crushing at 1.5$. Today he had 50%+ roi and itm !!! It was wonderful to see him so happy and thrilled about his ability and knowledge. In past month and a half since I started working with him ,he never had big upswing such as this one and now he has couple % roi on 1.2k games on 1.5$ 6 max stars.
Mark my words and remember what I will say now - he is one of the most talented sponge like students I ever had in poker , and I've coached over 30 people in past year and a half! He has tons of potential, everything I tell him he implements very fast, he works on his game super frequently. He even told my brother that he is determined to make it in this line of work and doesn't want to disappoint himself and me for believing in him! That's what true champions are made of, having that responsibility will carry him very long way and keep his motivation levels very high!

2nd session was also sweat and it was great. Watched some 6 max turbos but then told student to play HU hypers to practice his HU for turbos. While watching him play was very happy with the progress he made in past 2 weeks where we had 6 sessions. His HU is much better than it was, still needs work and space for improvement is there but his ROI in 6 max turbos will boost through the roof! Very pleased how things are going and to see him finally work harder and improve - results always follow with hard work of course!

In between sessions I went to drinks with my best friend and after to home cooked lunch. Awesome stuff!

My grind today was great results wise but volume was only 1 session 51 games. I wanted to finish earlier today cause tomorrow I got 2 coaching sessions minimum (I might squeeze in another one if students contact me via skype) then play around 100 games (that's the goal and idea but 1 session will be ok also) and later in the evening I will meet with an ex.
Should be very fun day!

Monthly results are getting close to EV (20 buy ins below ev only now), I ran above ev past 3-4 days I played but my level of focus and some advanced studying I did on my own (a bit 2-3 hours) really pushed my ev there for like 7% + ROI

For the end of this update here is daily graph and monthly now

February 13th
51 games (1.9 hours)
ITM 49%
EV ROI 10.1% (77.37$)
ROI 44.7% (341.65$)
1st 29.4% 2nd 19.6% 3rd 17.5% 4th 9.8% 5th 9.8% 6th 13.7%

Monthly so far
863 games (31.5 hours)
ITM 36%
EV ROI 1.9% (244.84$)
ROI -0.7% (-95.47$)
1st 17.4% 2nd 18.7% 3rd 18.5% 4th 18.3% 5th 16.5% 6th 10.7%

P.S For this year EV is 3.7% for 15s and 30s combined on 2.8-2.9k games, it can and it will go 4% and up I am positive about it!

Originally posted by tonypmm

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77
Checked Microgaming today, there was less traffic there compared to Ipoker.

And there will be even less after Unibet launches a standalone platform on the 19th (combining it with the Micro network for a while at first). I can't really complain as I'll be on both.

That's why I will prepare my students to crush HU and move from 6 max to HU hypers micro and low stakes 1st + I love HU so much

If Ipoker did 65-35 payout structure I would move them there but unfortunately 70/30 brings more variance on Ipoker

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77
If Ipoker did 65-35 payout structure I would move them there but unfortunately 70/30 brings more variance on Ipoker
Nit!

Let's compare variances for a player with 19% of 1st and 2nd (the tourney equity is then 19% of the prize pool, or 1.14 'pure' BI).

65/35: ((3.9-1.14)^2+(2.1-1.14)^2)*0.19 + (-1.14)^2*0.62 = 2.4282

70/30: ((4.2-1.14)^2+(1.8-1.14)^2)*0.19 + (-1.14)^2*0.62 = 2.6676

2.6676 / 2.4282 ~ 1.0986, i.e the iPoker variance is by <10% bigger.

This doesn't take into account that win % should be bigger on iPoker and the 2nd place % a bit smaller, but it's safe to say that difference is also minor then.

Originally posted by tonypmm

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77
If Ipoker did 65-35 payout structure I would move them there but unfortunately 70/30 brings more variance on Ipoker
Nit!

Let's compare variances for a player with 19% of 1st and 2nd (the tourney equity is then 19% of the prize pool, or 1.14 'pure' BI).

65/35: ((3.9-1.14)^2+(2.1-1.14)^2)*0.19 + (-1.14)^2*0.62 = 2.4282

70/30: ((4.2-1.14)^2+(1.8-1.14)^2)*0.19 + (-1.14)^2*0.62 = 2.6676

2.6676 / 2.4282 ~ 1.0986, i.e the iPoker variance is by <10% bigger.

This doesn't take into account that win % should be bigger on iPoker and the 2nd place % a bit smaller, but it's safe to say that difference is also minor then.

Somebody has to be nit here
They ain't that good HU yet to have even % yet alone more 1st places. In fact they mostly had 1-2% more 2nd places. This is due to 12 tabling, not working hard on this part of the game and I will say it I am to blame also cause my HU game sucked until like 2 and a half months ago. Now I am teaching all the edges in HU that help me have 3% more 1st on 15s without table selection. They should be able to crush 5.50+ microgaming with that. They are working on it heavily lately and ROI will jump up no doubt in near future.

There are basically 3 reasons why I don't want to move them there yet

1) They need to work more on HU to gain that edge to have more 1st then 2nd places (2-3% difference)
2) There is lot more regs on Ipoker then on Microgaming per table (Microgaming has 3 fishes every game , Ipoker you get on average 2 fishes tops)
3) ICM is different in push/call/rcall/3bet compared to 65/35

As soon as one of the guys gets really good at HU I will look into moving him there but until that happens Microgaming is the place to be.
When Unibet leaves I might have to move them all to Ipoker anyways cause traffic would probably go even more down then!

Didn't update in a day or two , couple of things happened

My wireless keyboard is ready to go to trash can !
The other day I spilled mineral water on it and it went crazy. Bunch of keys when you press them activate other functions and keys. I couldn't write in the blog and play neither.
Then yesterday took brothers extra keyboard to grind, played 150 games but it just felt super weird and different (it was cutting and slowing me down a lot while 15 tabling). In the end of the night I unplugged it and I will buy new wireless keyboard same like the last one for 20 euro or something tomorrow (stores don't work today cause its Sunday).

Basically today no grinding but coaching predicted with my brother and best friend (sweats, theory, hh review etc)

Today I also moved my double guitar lesson cause I am starting to feel a bit sick and didn't want to risk it in the lesson. I did give him assignments that he needs to follow and update me with his progress before our next lesson.

Before going to office I will cycle 10 mins (in past 10+ days I only skipped cycling 1 day and have increased past 2 days to 10 mins cycling with tv shows in background).
After that I gotta get some cash from ATM for future bills and life stuff and then I am ready to get to work in office.

I will look into some advanced concepts myself for my game vs Elio and other top regs also today.
Last time I worked on the game (couple of days ago) I found some bad plays they did vs me so I will aim to exploit them in those areas.

Regarding coaching, I am coaching 7 guys 10 hours each a month on average. Since traffic for 6 max on Microgaming is dying more and more , especially in the morning, I am dedicating 1 session per week with 3 students who play there to work on HU (mathematical concepts/ranges/post flop lines or sweat session). I hope within next 40+ days at least one of them will be ready to switch to play HU hypers exclusively (Curly most likely as he is improving fastest lately).
I am also watching new videos for HU and reviewing some powerful concepts/tips from crushers. Last night for example I watched 2 videos on BB play and post flop.

I am thinking of Ipoker cause they have traffic and different types of HU games + there is enough fish in HU games to make money at those stakes 2-5-10 $/euro). * Thanks Tony!

As far as my volume goes, I am now at around 1k games for February. I will try to hit 2.5k games this month, if I hit 2k I will not be disappointed cause I am putting much more focus and energy coaching those 7 guys + on life related things.

Speaking of life related things, since January I am spending tons more time with my family, have more time to hang with friends, for girls , even managed to watch some football which I didn't do for a while. So I am very happy and satisfied with my life balance the way it is now. I am playing less then before, true, but I am coaching way more and I have tons of other life things happening. Very soon I will look to add more guitar students.

LandlordUK will be very happy to hear that couple of days ago from blue got contacted by guy from BRAZIL via Facebook! He sent a long message asking about webcam guitar lessons, how he saw my youtube channels and videos , how he wants to work with me, asking about PayPal and all that.
It made me super happy that regardless of my brake from music and guitar for past year and a half, people all over the world still know about me and find me! It makes me realize how far I have gone in music and how many people I have helped where I definitely want to keep doing that in the future!

To finish this update, just want to say that I can't wait for 3rd round of HU Championship! Pleno is out in the 2nd round, my friend Gavron also busted out last night...
I am looking to revenge at least those two guys ♦
Opponents I would like to play for fun are Tony, dogma18, VarianceKiller, Chenny.
As far as super tough challenge part, I think any HU reg I would enjoy playing and wouldn't mind loosing vs him (if that makes sense). But whoever comes in the 3rd round I am looking to beat and move on

coaching so many new regs will soon make your own ROI to drop. it´s already regfest.

I think no coach shares all his secret strategies until they're proved to work (i.e. move the coach up stakes), so he always stays ahead of his students' learning curve and would have an edge on them if they played the same stakes.

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77
Opponents I would like to play for fun are Tony, dogma18, VarianceKiller, Chenny.

Please bust Chenny out, one time! (if you do run into him, of course; let you have the easiest opponents on the way up instead!)

All right, so now Dogma will have to eliminate Chenny, bring popcorn...

interesting hand against you yesterday,
would you play kqo 3bet/f or 3bet/c?

Originally posted by nurmalna
coaching so many new regs will soon make your own ROI to drop. it´s already regfest.

I don't agree with you there
Lets put it this way
There are coaches out there who coach concepts and there are those that teach tricks.
There are students that are looking for quick fix tricks and there are ones that are looking for every possible way to learn how to exploit and readjust to different opponents.
Most students fall in the 1st category and most coaches also teach tricks rather then concepts (it takes a lot to actually make program from zero for each student and teach them everything).

So, if most students are not hard working but are rather looking for quick fix solution, why should I as reg or any other reg worry about playing those guys in future?
I can always readjust to their strategy and counter it while if they don't work hard and study they will not be able to find edge vs me or other regs who adapt to their style of play.

This is why I teach my students and push them hard to analyze hands pre and post flop, develop very strong thinking process, learn how to exploit different opponents. It goes without saying that ICM is super important also (shove/call/r/call/3bet) + bubble and HU. So what I aim is to teach all those guys how to become great poker players long term, not to be afraid of 1 or 10 more new regs on their network.
I strongly believe any good reg will share my view on this because good reg is never afraid of competition, it will just make you better player make you work harder on your game and improve.

Just look at me and Elio Oneiro. That guy is surely diminishing my ROI but if it wasn't for him on 15s I would probably not have worked hard as I did on my game towards the end of the year. Good reg in your games will just make you better player - if that motivates you.
I have total respect for Elio Oneiro, wrote about it a while back also and he is the kind of reg that is adapting versus you frequently.
Is he the best out there? Probably not, he has leaks like I and we all do. The whole beauty of the game is to find those leaks and exploit them.
Playing good opponents will make you readjust your game plan versus them rather than having fixed robotic game and just expect to print money.

Ask 6 max hypers regs who chase SNE if they can have 1 fixed game plan and do it over and over? They would burn money and go bust after 2 months easy.
Its all about adjusting and readjusting constantly, finding new leaks for your opponents and of course fixing your own leaks so they have less ways to exploit you.

There is always easy way out of course - table select, choose a different format where you feel there is less regs, change to a different room/network or simply quit poker and let others work harder then you make all the money out there (not you directly but you as in player).

I wrote you all this response cause I feel you should never be afraid or angry if new regs are coming but rather welcome it as new way for you to improve and become a better overall player.

Look at it from the bright side always, in couple of years USA market will be back and then you will get more recreational players back but in the meanwhile work hard today to make even more money when that happens

Originally posted by tonypmm
I think no coach shares all his secret strategies until they're proved to work (i.e. move the coach up stakes), so he always stays ahead of his students' learning curve and would have an edge on them if they played the same stakes.

I don't mind my students crushing me in the future. Really! If they do that, then one of the two things happened:
1) I taught them really well
2) They worked harder then me and became better

Either way I enjoy teaching them and seeing them succeed. On other side I don't like seeing anybody fail. Failing can be only a good thing if it wakes you up and you start working even harder push yourself more etc. Most people tend to give up easily, they don't push themselves hard enough, don't even know what their maximum is... Those people neither I nor best coach out there will be able to help - cause they need to make a decision 1st that they really are willing to work hard to make it before anything!

Originally posted by IvicaIliev77
Opponents I would like to play for fun are Tony, dogma18, VarianceKiller, Chenny.

Please bust Chenny out, one time! (if you do run into him, of course; let you have the easiest opponents on the way up instead!)

I got SirTradesAlot. Hope I can beat him 3-0, continue my perfect record.

Originally posted by tonypmm
All right, so now Dogma will have to eliminate Chenny, bring popcorn...

This will be super interesting match. I would like to be observer of it, perhaps will see if Dogma can share screen or something for it ♦

Who is your opponent Tony, anyone you should be afraid of?

Originally posted by zygna
interesting hand against you yesterday,
would you play kqo 3bet/f or 3bet/c?

Hey buddy, interesting hand I agree

I assume you are talking pre flop for 3 bet?
Do you mean 3bet/f to shove or 3bet call small 4 bet? Its 2 different things

Also, you opened HJ which is tighter range. Since I don't have crazy dynamic with you like with Elio, 3 betting from btn KQo is best play for 2 reasons.
1) Its top of my 3 bet bluff range
2) If I flat it , there is risk of getting squeeze from blinds
3) By 3 betting I get initiative vs you post flop

Post flop, it hits our percieved ranges a lot. Most regs defend to 3 bet stuff like 88-JJ, A10-AQo,A9s-AQs, K10s-KQs, KJo-KQo, QJ, J10s, 109s etc
So that flop hits you hard but it hits me also. C betting in 3 bet pot is standard for me cause of couple of reasons
1) I have many times TPTK or TPSK + sets there in my value 3 bet range that hit that flop
2) I bet KQo there cause I still have additional equity and if you flat hands I mentioned I might get you to fold small pps, backdoor straights and such

Turn is pretty standard, when I raise you there I always have nuts (straight) or sets.

I think your call with AA is super standard on turn and you played hand really well.

Now I see that you flat to my 3 bet AA OOP so that tells me that perhaps in future (if you don't readjust) your 4 bet shoving range will be weak and your 3 bet flatting range will be stronger.
So now the fun things begin

I told you to table select me its better for your and my roi really
I will play 100 games minimum every day until the end of the month so hopefully I won't see you in many of my games, that was very well played hand - enjoyed it a lot.