Originally posted by nitrol
Originally posted by la55i
Villain didn't show aggression OTF. Why would we check when we hit strong?We didn't hit strong. There is a straight possibility and what hands will call out bet?
Well, we hit top set.. Only Tx is better than our hand. Villain can have a strong draw here, he can have some slowplayed sets and he could have hit 2 pair OTT.
Originally posted by la55i
Imo we cannot get scared every time there is better hand possible. I already said that villain can have weaker sets and two pair. His range is not 100% T's. Ofc we can x/c but I don't think betting would be bad. Basically if we are going to check call we can bet ourselves too.
It is not that we are scared. It is that up to this moment hands that we beat should have raised...
Originally posted by la55i
Originally posted by nitrol
Originally posted by marsa08
Originally posted by la55i
Is 4bb open your standard from MP?
I think I would call OTT. There is a small chance that villain has 99,JJ,QQ that he didn't raise OTF and if he has that T we still have 10 outs.It would be just a weird line from villain to slowplay a set otf and then raise all in when the one to a straight card comes...
It will not be weird. It is impossible.
Even fish will raise sets and 2p there.I think that statement is as false as it can be. Fish are perfectly capable of slowplaying good hands. Their mind works like this: i don't want to scare people out of the pot. Very often they will raise sets and 2 pair but you cannot say that it is impossible.
Fish will push sets on flop. Seen that a thousand times.
Originally posted by la55i
Originally posted by nitrol
Originally posted by la55i
Villain didn't show aggression OTF. Why would we check when we hit strong?We didn't hit strong. There is a straight possibility and what hands will call out bet?
Well, we hit top set.. Only Tx is better than our hand. Villain can have a strong draw here, he can have some slowplayed sets and he could have hit 2 pair OTT.
Ok you see our hand and see what hands beat us. What you do not see is that nothing worse is calling on this scary connected board.
Originally posted by nitrol
Originally posted by la55i
Originally posted by nitrol
Originally posted by marsa08
Originally posted by la55i
Is 4bb open your standard from MP?
I think I would call OTT. There is a small chance that villain has 99,JJ,QQ that he didn't raise OTF and if he has that T we still have 10 outs.It would be just a weird line from villain to slowplay a set otf and then raise all in when the one to a straight card comes...
It will not be weird. It is impossible.
Even fish will raise sets and 2p there.I think that statement is as false as it can be. Fish are perfectly capable of slowplaying good hands. Their mind works like this: i don't want to scare people out of the pot. Very often they will raise sets and 2 pair but you cannot say that it is impossible.
Fish will push sets on flop. Seen that a thousand times.
Fish will slowplay also. Have seen that too. My point was that you cant say it is impossible for them to slowplay.
Well i disagree but whatever. Do you send me a cookei if i can find you a hand where villain slowplayed set?
Ok maybee we give villian some range ...for example:
KK-99,ATs,KQs,QTs,JTs,T9s,ATo (it is 9 sets combos + 31 streets combos)
against this we have 39,18% TURN
we need around 34% equity
decisin: CALL
if we remove for example QQ from his range we still have profitable call
Originally posted by la55i
Well i disagree but whatever. Do you send me a cookei if i can find you a hand where villain slowplayed set?
No, because 1 in a million do not prove a call right.
Originally posted by sergii1984
Ok maybee we give villian some range ...for example:KK-99,ATs,KQs,QTs,JTs,T9s,ATo (it is 9 sets combos + 31 streets combos)
against this we have 39,18% TURN
we need around 34% equity
decisin: CALLif we remove for example QQ from his range we still have profitable call
Many of those hands ,you give as a range, are raising on flop.
Cut the number of combos of sets and 2p to 1/4...
Originally posted by la55i
No but it proves that it is possible...
It does not make a call profittable. That is what I mean.
And I cannot be sure this is a real hand.
Wow!
Well, as played. the math is that we need 4.5:1 for catching bluffs and are offered much less than that. We'd need to read a load of bluffs into villains range to call here. If we want to be unexploitable, well, we can call with 1 (of 3) KK combos. It is significant (for both math and reads) that villain raises.
The check-call strategy may be good. I like it for the reason that top set feels too strong to bet-fold.
