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turn decision with NFD

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ZakYoun270
Joined: 10.12.2015

Playing 5 handed UTG min raises to $2 and I flat A344 ds in the CO. $80 / bb effective. Family pot $10.

Flop is 398 with two spades and one club. checks around.

Turn is 5 h. SB leads for 2/3rds pot. Folds to me, button is still to act. So here I am getting 2.5:1 and have 7 nut outs, the non board pairing spades. I also have a bunch of potential hidden outs, such as three of a kind, aces up or a bike. It is also possible that the button raises after I call, which would mean that I forfeit my call. Looking at the nut outs only first, I have 7 outs and know 8 cards. So there are 44 remaining. That means my ratio of nut to non nut outs is 7:37 or 5.3:1 against hitting the nuts on the river. I decide that I do not have the proper odds to call and fold.

How frequently can we expect button to be raising the turn in this spot? Both SB and Button are regulars. What are the minimum odds we need to be receiving in this situation to make the call? Should I have bet the flop? Why or why not?


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SDK1987
Joined: 12.11.2008

I guess this is a live hand. Otherwise it would be better to use a converted hand history next time, because this isn’t easy to read.

It seems like already you made a good analyze, but it’s difficult to know how many times the BTN will raise. Every player is different and the turn seems like a blank most of the time and I don’t think he would raise to often.

Cheers,
SDK1987


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Padelbro
Joined: 21.01.2010

I would definitely call on turn. You have also implieds - it's hard to fold straight when board pairs, as there is a lot of missed draws. Sets usually lead flop, so yours is well hidden.

If you do decide to call this preflop, I dont know why you wouldn't bet flop playing from CO when ppl check to you and you've hit your sey? Why let them draw free?


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pizdunar
Joined: 01.08.2014

I wouldn't bet the flop because fold equity is low and we might get xr'ed. I think BTN only raises with a straight in this spot, how often he has a straight? depends on his preflop defending range but vs min open I assume it's wide+SB probably has it since he's leading on this board vs many people so it's even less likely that btn has it so I'd call.


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Padelbro
Joined: 21.01.2010

I dont like reasoning we have low FE to not bet with made hand. We have set that can get value and needs protection. If we get raised good, lets get the money in, it makes our life easy. Sure there is two bigger sets, but also ton of draws, pair + draws and rundowns with 98.


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Padelbro
Joined: 21.01.2010

Ok, obviously I read our hand completely wrong, I tought hero had actually set with 33 :(

I like checking with FD + pair otf. Turn could be close with those hidden outs, but I think opponent has straight heavy range and for a flush it will be harder to get value otr, so I like folding not closing action vs quite big bet.


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pizdunar
Joined: 01.08.2014

You're right, with guys being regs we're not going to get paid or a good price(BTN won't call much) so folding is better.


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