One more successful leaderboard run 
Since my return to GGPoker and 1K deposit I've scored 5 wins π₯ and 1 second place π₯ in German Spin and Golds High Leaderboards. This win pushed my rakeback for this month above 100%, it is now 109% to be precise. A dream of any Spin and Go grinder 
Nope, my calculation were adjusted to 12 games / hour / table when playing without breaks (calculation for 1 hour max) and 10 games / hour / table for longer sessions. I play 4 table (max for Germany) and on average have 41 games per hour. That's my comfortable grind tempo.
On GG Spin and Golds on average last 11 hands, where on 888 BLASTs last on average 9 hands.
4K -> 20K Bankroll Challenge Update
Week 1
Start of Week 1 BR: 4000 EUR
End of Week 1 BR: 5699 EUR
Tournaments played: 220
Week Profit: +1699
Challange Progress: 10.6% [IIIIIIIIII]
Graph
I'm a bit tired right now, so will post very short summary.
Highlights of the week:
- 20 Chips/T is good enough by itself of 50s, running above EV is even better. I'm happy to get a solid profit with small amount of tournaments poayed.
- I've met the first reader of my blog and Pokerstrategy user offline. It was a great night, we shared the food and our poker strategies, life stories, tips and trics and agreed to play a session offline in Spielbank for the next meetup. It was super-cool and reminded me one more time that blogging is +EV on so many levels.
- 1st place in the Leaderboard, can't get enough of those. It's a bummer that GGPoker keeps the history of leaderboard results only for current and previous month. It would be great to have a site / place, where history of leaderboards runs could be saved, like PokerProLabs or SharkScope, but for the leaderboards. I'm missing it so much that I consider developping one myself )))
Lowlights of the week:
- During one of the sessions I've lost internet connection and it took me ages to remember that I have a mobile phone and can turn it in alternative access point so I've lost all 4 tournaments in HU phases. Good that they still appear in PokerCraft and reflected in the PT4 graph (it was somewhere between 1300 and 1350 hands). Need to work on alternative connections as GG has disconnection protection with extra 30 seconds and games could be completed without accesspoint, just from the GGPoker iOS App 
- Nothing else really to mention. This week was short, crisp and profitable - strong start
I want to slowly shift to reporting progress on Wednesdays as that's the days where Leaderboards are finalized and restarted and more suitable for reporting. So I might do the next report a bit later.
Good luck on the tables, everyone!
While I'm waiting for the final hours of the German Leaderboards, I want to post a (not so) short overview of the differences between GGPoker.de (German) and GGPoker (World) rakeback systems, with a specific focus on Spin and Gold grind implications. I had a few unsuccessful attempts to build a bankroll here playing Spins that were crushed due to a lack of understanding and poor strategy. Hope you find it useful!
#1 π¨Additional tax on GGPoker.de from all tournament winningsπ¨
A huge factor that everyone should be aware of is that GGPoker.de charges an additional 3% tax on all tournament winnings, including Spin&Go. My first attempt to build a bankroll failed due to the lack of this knowledge. It won't show in your PT4 stats, but you can find this information when you register for a Spin&Go game or in the Transaction History.
Note: Further on, I will include this tax into Spins rake (7%) making it 10% overall. This is not precise calculation, as most players are not profitable pre-rakeback, therefore their cashes are lower than their buy-ins. So... tax on winnings is better than tax on the buy-in that includes rake in it. But for simplicity (I'm extremely good at multiplication and division by 10 :f_drink:), we'll keep it simple.
But don't worry, there's still a way to play your soon-to-become-favourite Spin and Gold format profitably. You don't need to play hard; you need to play smart, maximizing your rakeback.
The current rakeback system on GG for Spin and Gold players consists of three main promotions:
- Leaderboards (83% rake back this month) - If you're not on the leaderboard, are you even trying, or are you just spinning for the fun of it?
- Spin & Gold Challenge (20.4% rake back this month) - It's like defusing a bomb under time pressure, but instead of wires, you've got cards to cut through.
- Fish Buffet (5% rake back this month) - It's advertised as an all-you-can-eat buffet with up to 60% cashback, but for winning players, thanks to the PVI index, it's more like they're on a strict diet, getting at best 15% - you're not stuffing yourself with cash, just nibbling.
(There's also GGThanks and GGCheers promos, but the yield is so small that it's better to ignore them - unless you enjoy collecting digital confetti.)
And 1-time additional promotions like:
- First deposit bonus
- Honeymoon - Because who doesn't love a honeymoon where you get to play poker?
- 13M New Year Giveaway (I'll leave these out of scope as well - they're like those party favors you forget about until you find them months later in your coat pocket. But hey, playing daily missions and hitting that flip-out tournament was like finding an extra $200 in the couch cushions - a nice, unexpected bonus.)
Keep your cards close, your strategies closer, and your eyes peeled for Part 2!
#2 (GGPoker Rakeback System 1/3) Spin and Gold Leaderboards (LBs)
For me, and I assume for other German Spin and Go GG grinders on lower limits, this is the top contributor to overall rakeback. The LB50s gave me a solid 83% of rakeback this month. 
So let's dive into how Spin Leaderboards work on GG and the differences between the World and German variants.
The first and most important factor is that World leaderboards are daily, while German leaderboards are weekly, making them different disciplines. Here, the world runs in sprints, whereas Germans run marathons.
2.1# Earning Points
The first big difference is that German players receive the same amount of points for games across low (<$3), mid ($5-$20), and high (>=$50) buy-in ranges. So, there's no sense in grinding higher limits than the minimum for each buy-in range (0.25, 5, and 50) if you want to maximize your Leaderboard rakeback share, which is the biggest part of your rakeback.
You can notice that LB points are awarded in an arithmetic progression of 12-24-36 for 3rd-2nd-1st place. I'll use 2nd place as an average for LB points per game for calculation simplicity. One game gives 24 points outside of Happy Hour and 48 points during Happy Hour.
Note: In reality, if you're reading this, you're likely a winning player, which means your LB points per game will be even higher
2.2# Happy Hours
Happy Hour is an essential part of the Leaderboard strategy. For German players, those 2 hours every day give 2x Leaderboard points, while for World players, Happy Hour provides only 1.5x (so not as crucial, given it's from 7-9 am CEST and filled with regs grinding their way up the LB standings).
What did you notice first when comparing those two screenshots? Right... the Happy Hour logo. If this is GGPoker's attempt at localizing for the German market, they were too lazy to do their homework. Here's a much better logo for you, no thanks necessary:
I won't discuss strategies here for World LBs or German Low and Mid LBs. However, for High LBs, there's only one excuse to play outside of Happy Hours: on Wednesdays before the leaderboard finalizes, if you think there's a high chance to overtake a higher ranking, or if you're defending your ranking from someone trying to overtake you. Otherwise, all games should be played during Happy Hours. These are the best hours of the day to play (European late hours) and they give double points, meaning double rakeback.
And there you have the ins and outs of navigating the Spin and Gold Leaderboards on GGPoker.de. Remember, whether you're sprinting through daily challenges or pacing yourself for a weekly marathon, it's all about playing smart and capitalizing on those Happy Hours for maximum rakeback.
But don't cash in your chips just yet! The journey through GGPoker's rakeback system is far from over. In our next installment, we'll explore the Spin & Gold Challenge and Fish Buffet, where we'll reveal how to turn those promotions into your personal gold mine. Stay tuned, because understanding these elements can transform your gameplay from a gamble into a calculated strategy.
Keep your strategies sharp, your humor sharper, and get ready to dive into Part 3!
#3 (GGPoker Rakeback System 2/3) Spin & Gold Challenge
Let's delve into the Spin & Gold Challenge, a promotion that's consistent across both GGPoker World and GGPoker.de in terms of mechanics but differs significantly in rakeback due to the higher rake in Germany (10% vs 7% in the World).
The Spin & Gold Challenge is advertised with an enticing "up to 80% cashback," 
but let's get real - this figure is based on ideal scenarios in 6max Spin & Golds, which aren't available at higher limits. Here's the breakdown:
Reality Check: In the 3max format, which is more common, achieving that 80% is practically unattainable. Realistic expectations hover around 40% rakeback for the World and 28% for Germany at the highest levels.
German Player's Dilemma: With table counts limited to a maximum of 4 and optimal play confined to Happy Hours (2 hours max), the highest realistic challenge for German players is a 2-hour, Level 5 challenge requiring 36,000 gold, which nets you around 22.75% rakeback (highlighted in dark green on the screenshot). If you're looking to optimize your Leaderboard rakeback by accumulating fewer points, I sometimes opt for the 4th level with a 2+ hour challenge (light green on the screenshot).
Here's why this challenge is crucial
Stable and Predictable: Unlike other promotions, this one offers a stable rakeback component. It's wise to ensure you complete it. When in doubt about your capabilities at the start, it's better to undercommit and overdeliver.
Key Points for Success
- Choose Wisely: Select a challenge level you can confidently complete. Remember, any gold collected will vanish if you fail the challenge, so don't bite off more than you can chew.
- Time Management: The challenge begins as soon as you opt-in, so plan your time wisely. Opting out is possible, but you'll lose any gold accumulated.
This promotion is like defusing a bomb under time pressure, but instead of wires, you've got cards. Play it smart, not hard, and you'll see your bankroll grow with each successful challenge.
Stay tuned for Part 4, where we'll dissect the Fish Buffet, another piece of the GGPoker rakeback puzzle, and how to turn those fish points into cash rewards. Keep your strategies sharp and your calculations sharper!
#4 (GGPoker Rakeback System 3/3) Fish Buffet
Let's wrap up our rakeback journey with a deep dive into the Fish Buffet, GGPoker's loyalty program. This promotion is a staple for players looking to convert their rake into tangible rewards, but it's not without its complexities, particularly due to the mysterious Player Value Index (PVI).
Understanding PVI
There's a sea of articles online about the PVI, GGPoker's secretive metric that affects how many Fish Buffet (FB) points you earn per $1 or β¬0.86 in rake. The exact formula is as elusive as the Loch Ness Monster, but here's what we know:
PVI varies based on each player's game type, stakes, win rate, deposit, and withdrawal activities. It ranges reportedly from 0.1 to 2.0:
At 0.1, you earn 10 FB points per $1/β¬0.86 in rake.
At 2.0, you earn 200 FB points per $1/β¬0.86 in rake.
* In my calculations I don't use 0.86 EUR, but 1 EUR as the base.
New players start with a PVI of 1.0, but for those grinding heavily, this value can drop, sometimes as low as 0.3 over time.
I've been tracking my PVI for the last month, noting the following changes per session in my Excel sheet:
Started at 0.45
Dropped to 0.13
After a one-week break, it recovered to 0.25
Since then, it has slightly decreased to 0.24, meaning I earn 24 FB points per β¬1, taking only 24% of the advertised cashback.
You can see that while the GGPlatinum (top level) offers the same 60% advertised cashback, German players require fewer FB points to advance but receive less cashback along the journey compared to the World.
My Fish Buffet Experience:
As mentioned in the first post, this month, with β¬4,500 generated in fees and taxes, I received β¬210 back from the Fish Buffet, translating to a 5% rakeback. I wasn't particularly unlucky with the wheel spins and nearly reached Bronze Whale Level 2. I'm hopeful for a slight increase next month, but even at GGPlatinum, I wouldn't expect more than 15% rakeback due to my PVI.
Notes on PVI
There's chatter in the poker community that your PVI can improve if you move up stakes or take a break from the tables. So, if you're feeling like your PVI is in the doldrums, a change of pace might help.
In conclusion, while the Fish Buffet promises a bounty of cashback, the real catch is in understanding and navigating the PVI. It's like fishing in murky waters; you might not know what's below, but knowing the tricks of the trade can help you reel in a better catch.
Though players might get frustrated with GGPoker for introducing such an opaque rakeback system and advertising somewhat exaggerated cashback promotions, I'm not mad at them at all. Anyone determined to understand and track their rakeback will figure it out. However, this system can be a trap for inexperienced or recreational players who might easily fall for the hype. GGPoker does a fantastic job at bringing in new and recreational players to their tables. Big thanks to their efforts in keeping the poker community vibrant and diverse.
I've put in this extensive amount of text for multiple purposes: to summarize all this information for myself, to share my insights, and to highlight what was new or enlightening to me. While I'm quite sure that for most readers, there might be little new, I hope that for some, this has provided valuable insight. If that's the case, please share your thoughts in the comments or send me a private message; I'm very interested in any form of feedback.
Thank you for joining me on this deep dive into GGPoker's rakeback system. Whether you're a sprinter or a marathon runner in the poker world, may your strategies be sharp, your sessions profitable, and your Fish Buffet points plentiful.
Keep swimming through the poker seas, and may your next hand be a royal flush!
4K -> 20K Bankroll Challenge Update
Week 2
Start of Week 2 BR: 5699 EUR
End of Week 2 BR: 5986 EUR
Tournaments played: 215
Hands played on NL100 R&C: 407
Week Profit: +287
Challenge Progress: 12.4% [IIIIIIII]
Graph
Highlights of the week:
- I've posted what could only be described as a "wall of text" detailing my strategy for playing Leaderboards, aiming to educate and share insights with the community.
- A recruiter reached out with a very interesting and promising job opportunity; I've updated my CV and am looking forward to the interview process.
I had a very fruitful coaching session where we identified a significant leak in my gameplay (SB 3-Handed) and now I have solid study and drilling homework to tackle.
- I'll have scheduled time away from the tables for the next 10 days to recover and pay back my sleep debt.
Lowlights of the week:
- Our baby had vaccinations, and the first teeth are coming out, leading to a lot of baby cries and a significant lack of sleep at home. I'm generally very tired and sleep-deprived, which has impacted my quality of play and satisfaction from the game, making it the perfect time for a break from the tables.
This week, I've managed to keep the profit coming, albeit smaller than last week, while dealing with personal life challenges. I'm shifting to reporting progress on Wednesdays, as that's when Leaderboards are finalized and restarted, making it a more suitable day for updates. I expect my next report to be empty.
Good luck on the tables, everyone!
Originally posted by Studentishe
... to share my insights ... I hope that for some, this has provided valuable insight ...
Thank you! Every piece of information is helpful and valuable in one way or another. I am glad to be part of a community where people help each other to improve as entity in times like these where vanity and isolation are becoming more popular.
Thanks for your comment, very to read this! π€ Often times I feel that valuable knowledge that is needed to beat high limits in Spins is kept either in close circles (stables) or not shared at all. Iβm really happy to be a part of PokerStrategy community and share all I know and learn here, even if it means giving away some of the edgeβ¦
Originally posted by taavi1337
Would you pay to play poker competitively, like for charity etc?
Didn't quite get your question. I play poker competitively and I'm paying quite a bit to get better at it. Last year I've spent 5.7K total on coaching, new hardware, tools and subscriptions. But I'm not sure if that is what you asked about...
I mean if you had to pay to play that game and couldnt win money, would you play that game (online poker)?
Well, that's an interesting topic. Here's my take on it:
- On Unwinnable Games: If I believed a game is not profitable but still found it entertaining and competitive, I'd play it. I often make in-game purchases for games like MTG Arena and Rumble.
- Poker Experience: Even if I initially was a loosing player, I'd still pay to play, driven by the belief that with enough strategy, study, and the right approach, I could turn things around. For instance, in my first two years back at poker, I was in the red. I started 2024 with a deficit of -16K EUR, but by focusing on strategy and learning, I managed to turn things around, ending the year with a positive balance of +20K EUR in my Bankroll Tracker app.
- Play Money Poker: If you're talking about playing poker just for fun with play money on platforms like GG Poker, then no, I wouldn't be interested. The monetary aspect adds to the entertainment and competitiveness for me, which is missing in play money games.
Thanks for answering.
Yes I once tried to beat very strong players in table tennis tournaments with very aggressive strategy but is just a joke cause they are way better. But overall a good feeling, giving my best, practicing vs real fast unknown hits... The table tennis coach very much recommended to go to tournaments as well, not just practicing.
