[Closed] Weekly Vote: What's your take on Cheong's A7 hand?

Originally posted by chenny8888

Originally posted by santostr
I re-read from 5 handed...

1 hand Duhamel 3bets/folds to Cheong.
1 hand Duhamel raise/fold to Cheong 3bet.

That looks pretty standart... Not a pre-flop war.

Can someone not as lazzy as I am do the math? How much air is necessary for the shove to be +$ev, assuming he only 5bets/call QQ+ that way for value.

Or just cEV. Cause 1st prize is much more than 8.9 million with sponsorships, TV time, etc...

6+6+3=15 comboes of qq+. 24.134% equity when called.

Relevant action was 4bet to 14.25m, 5bet to 22.75m, ship for roughly 90m effective.

EV = FE(22.75+14.25) + (1-FE)[(0.24134*180) + (0.75866*-75.75)]
0 = FE(37) + (1-FE(-31.55))
31.55 = 68.55FE

FE required = 0.46

Duhamel needs roughly 13 comboes of bluff hands in his range for Cheong to make a +cEV shove. ATo = 12 comboes (to 5bet ATs is a waste of a hand), A9 = 16 comboes... oops we're already there.

NICE! TY for that.

I think that with the stack setup I'd just call pre with A8-AT IP, but he could do diferent. I guess that you can easily find 13 combos that would 3 bet/5bet bluff. The shove looks OK.
And the 5bet looks better and better to me

I also like Cheong's shove, especially when I consider the decision and pressure he has put Duhamel to and under.

Originally posted by Scarmaker
I also like Cheong's shove, especially when I consider the decision and pressure he has put Duhamel to and under.

I don't, Cheong had position on Duhamel for 66% of all the hands they played until the shortstack busts. Why give up all that positional advantage for the sake of bluffing one hand against the first 5 bet by Duhamel which was always going to be tight. Duhamel manipulated him perfectly into shoving through metagame play and Cheong fell for it.

Originally posted by Ribbo
I don't, Cheong had position on Duhamel for 66% of all the hands they played until the shortstack busts.

Good point.

EDIT: NO IT'S NOT. He has position only on the button. When he's BB Duhamel is the dealer. On SB he obv. doesn't have position.

Originally posted by Ribbo
Why give up all that positional advantage for the sake of bluffing one hand against the first 5 bet by Duhamel which was always going to be tight.

Why the first 5bet would be tight? It look super strong. Why not bluff with it?
As chenny8888 calculated, you don't need that many bluff combos to make the push profitable...

Originally posted by Ribbo
Duhamel manipulated him perfectly into shoving through metagame play and Cheong fell for it.

Agree.

Originally posted by santostr

Originally posted by Ribbo
I don't, Cheong had position on Duhamel for 66% of all the hands they played until the shortstack busts.

Good point.

EDIT: NO IT'S NOT. He has position only on the button. When he's BB Duhamel is the dealer. On SB he obv. doesn't have position.

Originally posted by Ribbo
Why give up all that positional advantage for the sake of bluffing one hand against the first 5 bet by Duhamel which was always going to be tight.

Why the first 5bet would be tight? It look super strong. Why not bluff with it?
As chenny8888 calculated, you don't need that many bluff combos to make the push profitable...

Originally posted by Ribbo
Duhamel manipulated him perfectly into shoving through metagame play and Cheong fell for it.

Agree.

I'm pretty sure Duhamel realises if his 5 bet isn't a shove, there is a good chance Cheong will see that as weakness and therefore an opportunity to shove himself. Knowing that, the first time he 5 bets it can only be with a strong hand.

I really feel strongly that Cheong levelled himself by putting too much faith in concepts like "blockers".

when the induce range is so tight blockers are effective. helps also to have 1 overcard vs a lot of his induce range.

cheong was awaer that he is the chip leader and new duhamel would of liked to not bust third, the mistake was induced by the 5 bet it;s clear duhamel played it perfectly, how many of us would of shuved as a 5 bet there? with q q , no he knew cheong was light and tried to induce the mistake, great great play, what cheong did was corect until one point it's poker, duhamel could of had k q , then he would of been a genious, or an ace could of hit, the unfair part of the story ... it's just a hand , i bet they play million hands in 6 months period so ... that's that