Starting ZOOM. is it profitable??

    • Berzerekki
      Berzerekki
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.12.2012 Posts: 172
      Hey!

      Im starting to play zoom 6-max and i was wandering is it profitable to play instead of normal cash games?
      And what about Hem2 HUD in zoom? Does it save stats normally in zoom? I am beginner at 6-max so should i play fullring first instead of 6-max. Im playing NL10 atm and trying to reach higher games: so 6-max would be very goood practice for my post-flop game. :)
      Any opinions about zoom? Good and bad things about it?
  • 18 replies
    • ShadDoneWin
      ShadDoneWin
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.08.2012 Posts: 161
      Well it's a double edged sword, you see. If you want to learn faster, get more fpp's and generally try and get more profit it is usually seen as a better option. (For the Micros).
      If you're a beginner at 6 max, I'm sure it will be -ev for you to start with and in the medium term.

      If I was you, stick with 10NL on the normal tables for at least 100000 hands or 2 months, if you're winning, then go to zoom, if not, then stick at it.
      You're going to get a lot of post-flop experience in still which you can convert to 6 max. There's also no reason why you can't watch 6 max videos, read literature and talk with friends while you're grinding 10NL. Every couple of days, open up 2 tables or so of 6 max, play a couple of hours, then review you hands and see your leaks.

      Imo, zoom allows you to lose your money a lot faster if you don't know what you're doing, so it's not a good place to learn.
    • mbml
      mbml
      Black
      Joined: 27.11.2008 Posts: 20,694
      u dont get to learn about picking up on reads at the micros

      but on the flip side you just end up playing way more hands, perfecting your optimal strategy and default gameplan, and get much more rakeback.

      I think the upside is much higher than the downside. people place too much emphasis on getting good reads.
    • Veini
      Veini
      Silver
      Joined: 11.10.2010 Posts: 638
      The zoom games are so much better then normal tables. Even though they are harder then normal its so +ev to learn how to play fastfold games as you will benefit from it so much later on. Starting a session at zoom is much easier then normal tables and getting volume is super easy.

      A benefit that often gets forgotten is that playing 4 tables of zoom you get 1000 hands/hour and you can concentrate in every spot. Getting 1k hands/hour at 12 normal tables will result in less focus in each spot and altough you get better reads you just dont get to use the potential of normal tables that well. (you can't concentrate on gameflow so easily mass multitabling.)

      I would advice that you should definately play fastfold games and the best nl10 fastfolds are at microgaming. 24hpoker nl10 blaze is full of fish and I'd say you could compare nl10 blaze to stars nl2 zoom. After getting a decent bankroll boost from nl10 blaze come back to stars and start grinding that nl25 zoom.

      Anyways best of luck and gl on the tables! :)
    • vuciitis
      vuciitis
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.02.2011 Posts: 1,314
      Originally posted by Veini
      The zoom games are so much better then normal tables. Even though they are harder then normal its so +ev to learn how to play fastfold games as you will benefit from it so much later on. Starting a session at zoom is much easier then normal tables and getting volume is super easy.

      A benefit that often gets forgotten is that playing 4 tables of zoom you get 1000 hands/hour and you can concentrate in every spot. Getting 1k hands/hour at 12 normal tables will result in less focus in each spot and altough you get better reads you just dont get to use the potential of normal tables that well. (you can't concentrate on gameflow so easily mass multitabling.)

      I would advice that you should definately play fastfold games and the best nl10 fastfolds are at microgaming. 24hpoker nl10 blaze is full of fish and I'd say you could compare nl10 blaze to stars nl2 zoom. After getting a decent bankroll boost from nl10 blaze come back to stars and start grinding that nl25 zoom.

      Anyways best of luck and gl on the tables! :)
      if u say that stars nl2 is like blaze nl10 were he should grind his roll, then were he is expected to get his experience for stars nl25? wouldnt that be compared to lets say nl50 blaze from what you are saying...?
    • Veini
      Veini
      Silver
      Joined: 11.10.2010 Posts: 638
      i'm only saying that nl10 blaze is a great place to boost your bankroll. Playing tougher games has also its values as you get better at actually playing. Still I think its better to grind a decent roll at a place where its super easy and then just take your time improving your game say 1 tabling nl25 zoom and maybe buying some training videos and going from there.

      Although playing though games has its merits, I still would choose a soft game always if i had to pick between tough opponents and easy $. ofc you can do the same amount of work in softer games for the next level. This is just a way to get there faster.
    • Shevtshenko
      Shevtshenko
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.12.2009 Posts: 4,087
      Originally posted by Berzerekki
      Hey!

      Im starting to play zoom 6-max and i was wandering is it profitable to play instead of normal cash games?
      And what about Hem2 HUD in zoom? Does it save stats normally in zoom? I am beginner at 6-max so should i play fullring first instead of 6-max. Im playing NL10 atm and trying to reach higher games: so 6-max would be very goood practice for my post-flop game. :)
      Any opinions about zoom? Good and bad things about it?
      1) Zoom almost certainly provides a better hourly.
      2) Hud works. Saves stats just like in normal tables.
      3) your choice, do whatever you feel comfortable with. In the end you'll have to play 6max anyway, since fullring zoom doesn't exist above nl100.
      4) Zoom is simply the best way to play poker on 2014.
    • mesisification
      mesisification
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.08.2011 Posts: 1,465
      Thanks for this thread, just realized that I really want to play zoom. Much more hands and way easier to start/end sessions!
    • remy18
      remy18
      Basic
      Joined: 05.02.2014 Posts: 39
      Tbh i fiind zoom only good for fun playing.
      I tried zoom 6 table session but found it very hard
      To focus after 2 h! Still learning thou so ty for all the tips!!
    • vuciitis
      vuciitis
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.02.2011 Posts: 1,314
      Originally posted by remy18
      Tbh i fiind zoom only good for fun playing.
      I tried zoom 6 table session but found it very hard
      To focus after 2 h! Still learning thou so ty for all the tips!!
      you should not be playing 6 tables of zoom if you are new to it (and poker in general as i assume), i find it best to play 3 tables when learning some concept for maximum focus... and i doubt that most ppl should play 6 tables of zoom more than 2h straight at all. that takes years of practice imo.
    • remy18
      remy18
      Basic
      Joined: 05.02.2014 Posts: 39
      You are indeed correct, i usually play 6 table 180 turbo but zoom was
      In the beginning , i was on profit but really exhausting! Personally i can play max 10 !
      In the end i m just glad to be part of this community and every opinion matters to me. Ty
    • mesisification
      mesisification
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.08.2011 Posts: 1,465
      Originally posted by remy18
      You are indeed correct, i usually play 6 table 180 turbo but zoom was
      In the beginning , i was on profit but really exhausting! Personally i can play max 10 !
      In the end i m just glad to be part of this community and every opinion matters to me. Ty
      You mean 180man turbo SnG? If you play 6-tabling 180mans normally and you want to play zoom in my opinion you should play only like 1 table, maybe 2! That's because in zoom you're just getting MUCH more hands than in 180man sngs. Even though the amount of tables is much lower if you play 1 zoom table compared to 6tables of those sngs the required amount of focus and skill to multitable is pretty much equal in my opinion.

      My point is that the amount of tables should be significantly lower when you play zoom compared to playing 180mans! If you can play 6 tables of zoom then you should be able to play like 20tables of 180mans at the same time in my opinion.
    • DrLongJohn
      DrLongJohn
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.03.2011 Posts: 25
      I played nl10 normal games before and i will go to zoom now. What material is good to study zoom game? Normal 6.max game material? I read some chapters of Poker Blueprint by Tri Nguyen and Aaron Davis and watch some free videos. I just stard to use HM2 too, how should HUD looks ( just vpip/pfr/3-bet/fold to 3-bet or more stats for these limit)? I would be very happy if someone will answer or give me any direction where to get more knowledge.
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,908
      Speaking for myself, stealing and blind defence seem to be more important in fast-fold games.

      I have steal overall and fold vs steal and resteal stats in my HUD, and broken down by position in a pop-up.

      You need to watch the players -- who is stealing a lot and who is defending a lot, and act accordingly.

      Building up a decent sample size in fast-fold games seems to take forever too.

      It seems that I'm SO often facing 5 unknown.

      Best of luck,
      --VS
    • Svinhugg
      Svinhugg
      Gold
      Joined: 20.08.2013 Posts: 367
      I have played poker recretionally for a few years but it is as late as this summer I started to seriously tried to improve my game.

      I spend 5-10 hours a week at the zoom-tables. Most of it on my phone where I play one-table full-ring, because if you play 6max on one table you often got stuck when youre at the blindpositions waiting for people to fold. I stay at fullring on my computer because I find it difficult to switch. My margins is to small. But on the computer I run 2-3 tables depending on my mood.

      The good thing with Zoom is that it reveals your shortcomings. If you are stubborn and not change your playingstyle money runs out fast. But if you keep your disciplin they comes in nicely. And lots of FPPs too.

      The bad thing is that you dont really learn to read other players as you do at ordinary tables. And ordinary tables feels really slow after Zoom.
    • vuciitis
      vuciitis
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.02.2011 Posts: 1,314
      not suggesting anything forbiden as we all know that datamining is not allowed, but there are magical ways to make your 10$ transform into more hands in your database. :f_biggrin:
    • Berzerekki
      Berzerekki
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.12.2012 Posts: 172
      Wow, lots of comments about ZOOM play. :)

      I've been inregularly played ZOOM. I haven't played a while because of my studies in university. But now im having a project to play only ZOOM tables for this month.
      I have to say, im not a 6-max person and i don't feel comfortable playing it because i have to "keep learning" all the time. And it's a good thing!

      Most of my mates from university plays 6-max zoom in NL100+ and they are playing it profitably. :P

      But winning rate is about 60-70bb/100 ?? I don't know what im doing wrong? Is my range too tight? Or is it just variance. I just wanna know what is your winrate usually?

      Sorry for my languange, i had a loong day.. :f_biggrin:
    • Rihard4a
      Rihard4a
      Gold
      Joined: 08.09.2010 Posts: 2,038
      Originally posted by Berzerekki

      But winning rate is about 60-70bb/100 ??
      LOLWAT
    • mesisification
      mesisification
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.08.2011 Posts: 1,465
      Originally posted by Rihard4a
      Originally posted by Berzerekki

      But winning rate is about 60-70bb/100 ??
      LOLWAT
      BALLER