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Le Tour De Stakes: Live Coaching Thread

    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128


      :diamond: WHEN: TUESDAYS 20:00 CEST
      :diamond: WHERE: Our Twitch Channel
      :diamond: WHAT: Tour de France is on, and it's time to start our own, at microstakes!
      Every week we first sit down as a team to look at the terrain (read: data and hands of the population and PokerStrategy members) of a microstakes stage, starting with the prologue, NL2 and NL5. Then we come up with a strategy together in the chat, and it's off to the races!

      This series is for you if you:
      • Enjoy a live action summer ride at the poker tables
      • Want to learn about poker peloton analysis, and share the approach YOU take
      • You're a poker rider on one of the stages and just want to learn how to beat them
      • Like having fun with other super cool people in the live twitch chat

      SCHEDULE
      Prologue (NL2) and Stage One: NL5 (31st July) - Video

      Stage Two: NL10 (7th August) - Video

      Stage Three: NL16 (14th August) - Video

      Champs-Élysées: NL25 (21st August) - Video
  • 36 replies
    • Bernasconi
      Bernasconi
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.08.2006 Posts: 486
      I am unfortunately on holidays during the first two Etapes. Any chance the sessions will be recorded and will be available after the live session so that I can catch up before joining you guys on stage three?
    • imgoingtomirage
      imgoingtomirage
      Headadmin
      Headadmin
      Joined: 03.07.2010 Posts: 23,845
      Yes, all sessions will be recorded and uploaded to the video section :f_thumbsup:
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128
      Today we are blasting off at NL5 after briefly zooming through the Prologue, NL2!
      Come join us as we first come up with a strategy, and then test it live at the tables!
    • metalmonkey80
      metalmonkey80
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      Joined: 15.08.2013 Posts: 2,797
      I will try my very best to tune in to this series :f_thumbsup:
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128
      Stream is online, Join us in a few minutes at
      https://www.twitch.tv/pokerstrategydotcom!
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128
      NL5 - Twitch Chat's Pointers

      NL5 - Range Research conclusions



    • MyFloXyBabY
      MyFloXyBabY
      Platinum
      Joined: 15.02.2010 Posts: 3,478
      Nice coaching, we've learned that la55i is a regfish isolating too wide :D
      Well, I guess I already had a few doubts... :P
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128
      The fold to cbet is still in the low - mid 40s range after limp-call
      and fold pre around 17% and rarely will limp 3bet to force you out of the equity so technically the numbers don't prove you can't iso wide, just that you do have to pick your spots :)
    • MyFloXyBabY
      MyFloXyBabY
      Platinum
      Joined: 15.02.2010 Posts: 3,478
      I do agree, indeed, that it'd take a somewhat more torough statistical analysis to prove that la55i is a regfish ;)
      But I'm not losing hope... maybe next week ! :coolface:

      Joke aside great coaching, Hand2note is the nut and I can't wait to see the same theme applied at higher stakes !
    • aafrancis
      aafrancis
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.01.2011 Posts: 9,667
      another Nice topic by Lemon36 ! :f_thumbsup: :f_thumbsup: :f_thumbsup: :f_thumbsup:

      i will follow for sure !!

      :f_drink:
    • winterguy
      winterguy
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.02.2011 Posts: 9
      Will the videos be linked in this thread?
    • la55i
      la55i
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 27.01.2013 Posts: 8,524
      Hmmm regfish :f_eek: well, it is still better than fish fish :f_biggrin:

      I didn't watch the coaching but would love to join this discussion. What have I done now to be a regfish? I guess we were talking about villain limping and we iso-raising and cbetting very frequently?

      If you guys talked about that, in my analysis the fold to cbet stat is close to 50%, not in the low-mid 40s as lemon said. And if I filter these situations I'm getting 280bb/100 winrate in these hands. Although the sample size is quite small at 550 hands.

      I'm just actually testing the waters there and see if those limp callers can really be outplayed easily. I don't have enough data myself yet. But if you manage to get more data and show me it is a regfishy move I'm happy to stop it :f_biggrin:



      And if we take away the postflop action from the filter, just look at the hands where I have isolated one limper, then I have 1130 hands with over 150bb/100 winrate. Sooo I'm not sure what I really should be doing in those spots but that doesn't look too bad for me.

      Of course I might have been lucky. Or then I'm just extremely good and can do tricks OTT and OTR also :pcuser:
    • Post removed

    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128
      Actually yeah it's Limp fold 23% of the time
      fold flop 47%, 44% vs me so a wide iso strategy can still be fine, especially in posittion

      One thing that comes from the report is that you won't see a clean split in ranges
      The blue is limp at NL5:



      So you got to be careful with hands like AXo Q8oetc. that are often dominated especially out of position as people are limping strong hands
      From the data it does seem like you need to pick your spots even at NL5 instead of the blind mashing of iso button with wider ranges than you'd raise as default :)
    • la55i
      la55i
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      Joined: 27.01.2013 Posts: 8,524
      Yea people do limp super strong hands from time to time. For that reason I usually take one stab with small to medium bet size and if I get called I usually slow down a lot. That is because 1) they can have very strong hands in their ranges and 2) because I think they often play fit or fold so when I get called I usually believe them :) In my experience if limp caller calls a cbet OTF he most likely has a made hand or a draw and often calls the turn again.

      And also, I'm not iso-raising super wide. I'm just cbetting very frequently after I did iso. So I do not recommend that blind mashing of iso button :f_biggrin:
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128
      Well you just have to come next time haha :D
      We actually found that you should cbet, a lot in general at nl5, then on the turn you really only need to pick good spots because the fold there is low

      But surprisingly people will then fold too much on the river on average
      (actually Mr. L33t dood predicted this)
      So at Nl5 bluffing the river In good spots especially vs weak/capped ranges will be profitable
    • la55i
      la55i
      Moderator
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      Joined: 27.01.2013 Posts: 8,524
      Sounds good. And I do agree that cbetting a lot is good but I still would be a bit careful when out of position. Interesting to see what kind of changes you find when you go up the limits :)
    • bigdog63
      bigdog63
      Gold
      Joined: 24.10.2011 Posts: 354
      It was a great session and I was deeply impressed by the power of "Range Research" in H2N. But I am even more impressed by the speed by which DocLemon drew his conclusions. And the other. Old guys like myself are sooooo slow and I am really good at math ?(

      Resultswise, not only the frequencies are interesting, but even more so the difference between the whole population and the "regs". Apparently, regs can be readily owned with "standard" moves like barreling, cbetting etc. Not so much with the population as a whole, or did I misinterpret?
    • LemOn36
      LemOn36
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 07.02.2009 Posts: 2,128
      Yeah contrary to previous beliefs at NL5 you can indeed bluff river vs regs and population alike if you pick your spots right
      As fold to rivers cbet hovers around 50% for both groups
      And on the turn you can barrel turn also within reason vs regs as the fold is at 42%
      (compared to the population at around 1/3)

      And regs you beat by
      1) Stealing, a LOT, almost blindly
      2) cbetting a lot more than average
      3) picking your river bluff spots and pulling the trigger
      4) folding to river barrels and large bets, especially overbets in general
      5) 3betting their BU and SB opens on the wider side
      6) Attacking checks vs PFR

      While paying attention and being careful especially on reg tables that individual players aren't catching up to what you're doing.

      This is to maximise profit, another approach would be to just play as solid poker as possible if you have long-term in your mind that will work on any limit vs anyone, while leaving some of this easy exploitable money for this particular pool at the table for the sake of your future game
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