[NL2-NL10] NL25 - One Overcard & a Fishy Flop Bet

    • Kknight
      Kknight
      Global
      Joined: 30.04.2007 Posts: 374
      No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (9 handed)

      UTG+1 ($15.50)
      MP1 ($5.30)
      MP2 ($6.60)
      Hero ($5)
      CO ($27.80)
      Button ($14.70)
      SB ($4.05)
      BB ($16.85)
      UTG ($23.85)

      Preflop: Hero is MP3 with T:heart: , T:club: .
      [color:#666666]3 folds[/color], MP2 calls $0.25, [color:#CC3333]Hero raises to $1.25[/color], [color:#666666]4 folds[/color], MP2 calls $1.

      Flop: ($2.85) J:club: , 6:heart: , 8:spade: [color:#0000FF](2 players)[/color]
      [color:#CC3333]MP2 bets $5[/color], Hero calls $3.75 (All-In).

      Turn: ($10.35) K:club: [color:#0000FF](2 players, 1 all-in)[/color]

      River: ($10.35) 8:diamond: [color:#0000FF](2 players, 1 all-in)[/color]

      Final Pot: $10.35

      I thought that huge overbet was a bit fishy...like he was trying to bully me out of the pot (maybe thought I missed with AK?) With only one overcard, I figured it was worth calling...was that OK or should I just fold here?

      Thanks,
      Kknight
  • 4 replies
    • Berliner1982
      Berliner1982
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.07.2006 Posts: 5,644
      Tough decision without any reads on your opponent. Would he have checked you would have made a C-Bet anyway, but often would have folded against a check-raise, since the board is very try (only a uncommon Straightdraw is possible). This overbet could mean he has something that beats you or he has nothing. I guess I would fold here and see if he does that more often in the future against me. If so, I would call him in similar situations.
    • Kknight
      Kknight
      Global
      Joined: 30.04.2007 Posts: 374
      Now this is a situation exactly like the common one I was asking about in my c-bet sizing thread.

      ASSUMING he had checked, wouldn't I have been better off just pushing as a c-bet? There is $2.85 in the pot, which would call for a $2 c-bet, but that would only leave me with $1.75, which doesn't seem to make much sense as it leaves me pot-committed anyway without enough money to have fold equity on the turn, correct???

      Anyway, in the hand as played, I think the biggest problem with my call is that a call (obviously) doesn't have any fold equity. You're right that I probably should have folded there...and I knew better at the time...but with that strange bet, curiousity got the better of me and I was just too tempted to look him up (he had JTo.)

      Thanks,
      Kknight
    • Berliner1982
      Berliner1982
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.07.2006 Posts: 5,644
      I personally depend my decision between pushing or giving up my hands in situations like this (when I´m in position of course), on what case has the higher possibility. If he calls me more often with weaker hands I push here, but if he only calls with stronger hands I check behind on these flops. So it depends on my reads on the opponent. Against very aggressive Players who like to check/raise on these boards with 99, 77 or two Overcards, I tend to push here.

      Like I already mentioned, their is no general right answer, unfortunally. The SSS is much more complex then most people think she is.
    • Kknight
      Kknight
      Global
      Joined: 30.04.2007 Posts: 374
      OK...fair enough. But you did answer my question more than you think you did by saying that you choose between pushing or checking behind. That is basically what I was trying to figure out. In other words, a $2 c-bet pretty much NEVER makes sense here, right? Since it leaves you pot-committed and it doesn't make sense to bet $2 and then fold to a raise for only another $1.75 into what is now a $7.85 pot.

      I know that whether or not to c-bet depends on reads. That is why the question was about the size of a c-bet, not whether or not to make one. I think you answered that question.

      Thanks again,
      Kknight