Cooler or am I a donk??

You're in the small blind with a very bad starting hand, this should have been snap folded preflop to the first raise. You're going to make idiot end straights when the board runs out 567 and you're going to be chasing flush draws with no other way of winning (meaning getting your stack in 65/35 behind).

This hand is the very definition of trap and you need to be tightening up a lot preflop from the small blind as you're going to be spewing a lot of money if playing this hand is any indication of what you think you need to justify a preflop call.

This is highlighted exactly by your eagerness to stack off, even though you don't have the nuts on the flop. That is the problem with your starting hand, you will make the second best hand post flop a lot of the time, like if the board runs out AA9 or AT5 you will just have no idea where you are.

Putting in 350 bets on the flop without holding the nuts or having a strong draw to the nuts is just complete and total spew. What on earth do you think he is holding when he shoves this flop? There isn't a hand in poker where you are ahead here.

sill disgusting losing an 800bb pot!

Originally posted by dogma18
sill disgusting losing an 800bb pot!

Then don't stack off without the nuts in a potential 800bb pot!

its actually laughable that you can say this....

I went over this hand with a plo200 reg and its an auto stack off.
I don't think the call preflop is in any way loose. and when i flop the 2nd nuts+ top 2+ backdoor flush draw, check raise is standard. when he shoves after calling on flop, its awkward but i cant always put him on 63.

I don't mind a hand evaluation where I'm in the wrong. But essentially all you're doing is criticizing a play in which you would probably make yourself.

But again who am i to say, i only have 10k hands at PLO. great advice anyway!!

I would not ever make this play because I would fold preflop and I would also realise on the flop that my opponent is not coming over the top on the flop without the nuts. There is no flush draw showing and he isn't going to stack off with 678x.

Your PLO200 reg, with the greatest of respect, doesn't know what he is talking about. Checkraising just isolates yourself against better hands where nobody can call your checkraise without the nuts. What you are doing is committing yourself to putting in 350 bets with a checkraise where simply calling doesn't commit you.

This is not a board where someone can cbet without actually having a strong hand due to being super deep.

board: 2c 4s 5d

Ah 4h 5s 3s 26.78%
36** 73.22%

When villain shoves the flop you still don't have odds to call because you know 100% that he has the nuts. If you had checkraised less you can get off the hand without committing yourself. If you're ahead villain still folds to a smaller checkraise (which looks super powerful, like you have 367x) he certainly can't float you with air.

I really hate checkraising this flop and it is not super standard at all.

I'd really recommend going back to the basics, learning more preflop theory and postflop thought processes, and especially not playing this deep if you don't have the appropriate knowledge to do so, as the mistakes will be exponentially more costy.

By losing a 400bb pot, IF you had a 10bb/100 winrate (which I highly doubt that you do have on PLO25 after playing only 10k hands), you would need 4k hands to make it all back. 4k hands for one simple mistake, do you know how many hours that is (ok, you do have some equity, so it's a bit less, but you get the point)?

Maybe moving to a lower limit would be more beneficial for you as well, as after 10k hands you're really just a BE player at best on PLO25 if you make such mistakes... Of course it depends on the platform etc., but still - PLO25 isn't as easy to beat as PLO2 or PLO5 for example.

And I'm not trying to critisize you or anything, just don't want you to lose money unnecessarily... It would be so much more beneficial for you to work on your game and/or stick to lower limits for some time than to lose money like this :|.

lol Schnitzelfisch.

Im a consisitent winner at holdem, triple draw.
Decided to work on this variant to improve my overall game. I have the bankroll for PLO100 so playing plo25 is mainly for volume and to get hands under my belt.

What you guys are missing from this hand is that to put an opponent on a hand range that consists of 63 that he would raise/call preflop with is quite rare.
Think about it 6363ds maybe 3456 maybe aa63, kk63...unlikely.

Preflop Ribbo keeps saying is bad..its depending on how you play it. Im only putting my money in with the absolute best of it over the majority of time. You's can say ''aha, you didnt put you're money in with the nuts did you?'', well versus his preflop range i don't think i'm always behind, and may run into A3 in which im huge favourite, or a set from a poor player.

Here's another example of why you can't put him on 63 every time. If you assign him a super loose range(fishy range) which consists of A367(this is what he had), that will call a 3bet pre flop with, then surely when he shoves flop, its not necessarily the nuts every time.

Finally, obviously its preflop where i went wrong, then I ask this. What hands should I be playing from the small blind that doesn't include small double suited connectors? Essentially its everything that is just slightly better than this hand and we all know the equities are so close in Omaha,Ii doubt its such a huge mistake seeing a flop when you know that the majority of the time, the 3 bettor from the BB has AA combos.

Just my thoughts anyway. Im Omaha noob so don't criticize me too much.

Playing 400bb deep out of position is something you really don't want to do, unless you know that the opponent is very bad. Here you don't give any reads on the guy.

I think that the check-raise on flop is the worst thing here. What do you think that CO is going to call you with? With that raise and 2nd nuts to that board you are just isolating yourself against a very strong range. Why not call and see what happens on the turn? Yeah, there are bad cards but if the turn is 6, 7 or 8 and CO starts to put money in the pot you should know that you are beaten.

I don't know who this PLO200 player is, but I would really like to hear his reasoning why this is "standard stackoff". It's like shoving 77xx there in K72r flop.

Having 63xx in CO opening range is not that rare.

What comes to the preflop, you are calling deep oop with a hand that is going to flop 95% problems. The single strong hand you can hit is a flush. And playing flush draw oop profitably isn't the easiest thing in the world. You will hit bottom end straight and top/bottom 2 pairs a lot of times. If the board is like AJ4, what do you do? Or AT9 with two spades?

It looks nice, but it has problems written all over it.

i actually agree with everything you say Kyyberi. and with only starting at Omaha i should avoid problem hands, especially OOP.

One point i will make, is that what hands should i be check raising this board with in a 3bet pot, Is it only the nuts? I'm annoyed at how much i raised to as it pot commits me, if i raise to like $21-$25 i could probably get away when he shoves but its hard.

In that situation the problem with raise is that it villain can't really call it without the nuts. Or of course he can, but he shouldn't. And if you have the nuts without redraw, you are just making pretty much all the worse hands to fold. The board is very dry, which is the key point here.

You don't have to balance your raise range, and I don't think I would raise there ever without at least the nuts. When CO calls, he clearly has something. So you can't raise there as a bluff.

Originally posted by dogma18

Finally, obviously its preflop where i went wrong, then I ask this. What hands should I be playing from the small blind that doesn't include small double suited connectors?

When 400 bets deep out of position, you should be playing pretty much nothing from the small blind apart from super premium hands.