[SH] NFD in 3B pot multiway with a maniac

Seems like I found the answer. If we pretend that shoving flop is the same as calling CO's shove (and it is, because he never folds to a shove here), then we can calculate how much equity we need for a shove. We need 39%, but against his range of 2P+ we have only 30%. So it's a fold.

A side question please: I like to think that it's very profitable for me to sit on a table like this with a maniac on my right. But then I start flatting him with value range, face 150% flop cbets followed by 150% barrels, and don't really know what to do. I mean I do know what to do, in theory, like I made a note that it seems like he isn't overbluffing all the time, but just overbetting his made hands, etc. However in practice I start thinking that perhaps even having bad TAGs on my right may be more profitable considering variance, tilt, my shaky bankroll management, and simply the fact that all my poker homework is about playing against regs, and not this. What are your thoughts? Do you sit on these tables yourself? Any tips?

i play these guys, you just have to understand what are the "good enough" parts of your range and not fold. to keep it easy you want to hit a decent pair that's not vulnerable (like most broadways)

i hate the preflop call. i think CO should be value-4betting pretty light here like at least TT+ AJ+ KQ

I would rather fold preflop, especially when there is no for granted that the CO will just call.

The call preflop is the worst option. We can fold and save ourself the money and trouble for another more profitable spot or we can 4bet/fold and put some pressure on the light 3 bettor.

Wait, wait, hang on guys.

CO will value 4B TT+ AJ+ KQ? I just don't see this happening, SB is aggro but he does have filters and won't shove preflop with trash, therefore CO isn't looking to stack off with KQ here. And who value 4B AJ and KQ ever, especially IP against an aggressive min-raise? I say CO should call every time here everything except QQ+ and AK.

And do we really fold? He just raised a steal by 1 bb. This doesn't look strong, and CO's range isn't strong either. I would fold if it was a normal 3B. We need to have 12% equity here to make a call, and we will have position on PFA. We surely have that much, right, so calling is more profitable than folding.

I guess seeing how it gonna be 3-iway I would rather call suited aces and connectors here, or even pockets. They flop a monster or a strong draw more often than 12% of the time. But I don't think ATo is a problem, it's only 12%!

uh you don't have to call shoves wide (though maybe you could), just get more money in preflop with the best hand, and then sb makes bad calls or has to fold? you can 4bet yourself and then cutoff folding and sb calling is living the dream, or you could leave it to cutoff to 4bet (even if he's only 4betting standard, it's not 12% equity needed since he doesn't 4bet 0% of the time)

Originally posted by Tomaloc
(even if he's only 4betting standard, it's not 12% equity needed since he doesn't 4bet 0% of the time)

This makes sense, you're right.

Not sure I understand the rest? I guess I can stick to cold-4B or fold strategy in these spots even against a min-raise. This sounds more solid unless I can evaluate the risks of cold-calling a 3B properly. If we do that, should our range be depolarized? I'm thinking we can go as low as 99+, A2s+, AJ, KQ, depending on the villain, and we fold everything else.

Our hand doesn't play well in a mw pot, oop, without initiative. So here you can fold or you can bluff 4bet and try to put pressure and try to collect the dead money. You are exploiting the situation here.

fold pre, flop call is really horrible IMO to the overbet & player left to act, also if we hit the diamond he may not put any more money in

I agree with folding preflop. For CO it´s must call and I don´t want to play ATo 3way sandwiched. Plus CO can still 4bet given his stats (I don´t think your CO RFI will be very accurate on this sample)

Originally posted by Th334
Wait, wait, hang on guys.

CO will value 4B TT+ AJ+ KQ? I just don't see this happening, SB is aggro but he does have filters and won't shove preflop with trash, therefore CO isn't looking to stack off with KQ here. And who value 4B AJ and KQ ever, especially IP against an aggressive min-raise?

CO doesn't look very competent, but wide 4betting here looks good idea in his shoes.. Aggrofish can have any crap that he calls and eiher folds or stacks off postflop with worse. Your call pre is very weak, and it's very good result for him if his 4bet with for example KQ gets you to fold your hand.

I like option of cold 4 beting small for bluff(maybe even value) against such guy to play him HU IP

I like the idea to try and isolate the fish or collecting thedead money right away with our hand.