Carl Froch reveals how boxing tactics can translate to the poker table
We sat down this week with former boxing world champion & big poker enthusiast Carl Froch. It’s been 10 years since ‘The Cobra’ hung up his gloves and the Nottingham born boxer has been a regular poker player throughout his retirement.
How do boxing tactics translate onto the Poker table when in a tense situation?
Carl Froch: I think you can compare the mind games when you're in a hand, more so when you're playing on the table rather than online. Some of the players you recognise and you get to know because you know who they are.
Carl Froch: When you're sitting around a table, being a combat sportsman, I think there's a big advantage, or at least a massive help, because you get used to facing off against your opponent and pressing off from one fight like that. And you have to look in their eyes. And you have to know if you've hurt them. You have to know if they fancy the job or they're tired.
We saw a classic between Conor Benn and Chris Eubank Jr at the weekend. It was an epic spectacle. Not the most technically exquisite of fights, but nonetheless, everyone was fully entertained.
Carl Froch: Exactly right. It was an entertaining fight. It was edge of the seat stuff, especially towards the end when Eubank sort of got in front of Conor Benn and just opted to stand still, I was impressed and thought it was good performance from both of the guys. Technically if you wanna strip it down, you could really find a lot of flaws. They did a lot wrong. Especially Conor Benn, he wasted a lot of energy on the outside, maybe a lot of nervous energy.
Yes, he's had 20 odd fights, but he's not got an amateur pedigree. So he is learning on the job. He was up against a decent pro in Eubank Jr, the more experienced man. So it made for a good fight. Because Eubank was evidently tired from rounds three/four. I think he got clipped in round three and then he wanted to recover. I think it was a left hook. He looked unsteady on his legs and I think by round five or six he realised that he couldn't move to keep out of Conor Benn’s way because it was going to drain more and more energy. So he just stood in.
"Benn vs Eubank was a great spectacle"
They made the ring smaller anyway, didn't they?
It would have suited Eubank more because of his movement and his height and reach, but he's a better fighter than he's a boxer. He can stand and have a fight. And he likes a brawl because technically you've got to be good to be a boxer. And I'm not saying he's not good, but he's not experienced.
He never had amateur pedigree. Didn't box him when he was a kid. When you've not got that amateur experience, you kind of don't develop those sort of cognitive skills and basic fundamentals of boxing. So you see what you saw there, you saw two guys who've got no amateur experience, both learning on the job. Eubank won’t learn much more. But Conor Benn is still kind of learning.
The fight was technically poor, but it made for a great spectacle because it was an even match. So a close fight, you can have two people that aren't very good at all. You see some really good white collar fighters. Neither of them can fight, but they're both on the same level. I thought Eubank was in control all the way through. He got clipped with a shot in round three, then a couple more later on in the fight. But for me Eubank was in control. He's got that height and reach, he's got all that experience.
And as soon as he went close to Conor Benn, I thought, ‘right, this's gonna go one of two ways. Gonna walk into another shot and you're gonna get knocked out, or you're gonna just stay in survival mode, but just keep throwing arm punches.’ Because that's what he was doing. He was throwing arm punches. Just tip, tap, tap, tap. Keep punching away, keep working away. Catch the judge's eye, score the points, win the round.
That’s what he does and it was quite a close fight, but the right man won. And it was entertaining because Eubank did get clipped with some shots and then he was bouncing Conor Benn’s head all over the place at the end of round 11 and beginning of round 12. People said it was abit wide and that the score card was silly, but we're just happy to get the right result. Whoever won the fight, deserves to have their hand held high. Conor Benn didn’t deserve to win so the right man won. It was a good fight. Great for television, great advert for boxing, 67,000 fans there but not 80,000.
I’m not sure the rematch should even be a thing. The first match was great, great. We've seen it. Now we know what's gonna happen. Benn's not big enough to be at super middleweight. But Benn fought his heart out, he gave it a right go. He needs to go back down to 147, he’s 28. Have a couple more fights. Get back into the rhythm and hopefully he won the British public back over because they've all turned on him over the drug testing issues.
There was a lack of viable explanation or reason why what happened happened. I’ve put it past me. I'm not bothered about even discussing it anymore. Conor Benn has been absolutely ridiculed. Pulled down and written off. Now hopefully he showed his gutsy performance last Saturday night. Yeah he lost a fair decision. But he tried really hard and did himself proud for his team. He can come again. He was devastated though wasn’t he.
He looked heartbroken in the ring.
I don’t think I’ve ever been that gutted when losing a fight before. Even when I lost my first time against Mikkel Kessler. It was a close fight but I was fighting a Danish kid in Denmark and I didn’t get the decision. I was gutted I lost the WBC title of course.
"Eubank Sr was a British Treasure"
Maybe deep down you knew you were always gonna be able to avenge it though, do you think?
Yeah, possibly. I was in that tournament actually so hat's a good point. I was in super six in my very next fight. But I lost to the better man on the night. I gave it my best. I didn't let myself down. As long as I don't let myself down I was happy. But I did let me self down in amatuers a few times, in the Olympic qualifiers, I underperformed, I missed out on the Sydney Olympics because I lost a qualifier and I just thought ‘I didn't quite go for it in that last round.’ But they're all learning curves. They're the learning curves that are learning fights that Conor Benn and Chris Eubank do not have. I had over 100 amateur fights. So you get in the ring and you’re fighting, exchanging leather. You get beat and you win some, you lose some. You learn something about yourself. Grow mentally, physically, you develop as a fighter. And when you miss that whole apprenticeship, it's difficult. So these two boys have done really well to fill the stadium with 67,000. They’ve earned some money 10/11 million, whatever the rumors are. They’re just living the dream off their father's name.
The roar when Chris Eubank Sr stepped out of the car was amazing. Possibly the biggest moment of the night.
Yeah possibly. I enjoyed seeing it there when the door opened, it was all built up nicely. But everything that he was saying about the weight and the infringement of the rules and how it's wrong and that it shouldn’t be happening. Was that all nonsense or was that part of the game? So I think it was a bit of gameplay wasn’t it.
But I like Christian Eubank Sr. I like Junior as well, but I like Sr. He was a character. And he was a great fighter. He had real good finesse in that ring. He speaks well. He has got his own YouTube channel as well which I enjoy. I just like listening to him. He's quite a fascinating character and you have to give him his credit for that. And he's had it hard as well. He's been through bankruptcy and when he talks about Sebastian, his son who he lost, it's heartbreaking. What he’s actually been through, your heart goes out to him.
He’s had it tough and he’s a nice guy. A British treasure. That win over Nigel Benn was amazing and then the draw 2 or 3 years later, you can’t take it away from him what he’s done. Abit like Frank Bruno. He's been great for boxing and he's still relevant.
"Eddie Hearn is a grafter"
What do you expect from Chris Eubank Jr now? Do you think he's gonna go away? Just take stock and then wait for the offer of the rematch to see how much they're gonna potentially pay him for that?
Carl Froch: I'd be surprised if Conor Benn wants that fight? His trainer, Tony Sims knows better than to put him back in there. I don't think it'd be at 160 anyway. And Conor Benn's not a super middleweight. So if you are looking after Conor Benn and not the bank account of somebody else, then you are not taking that fight. And if he's serious about professional boxing, he canh build a career now based on that, he's got money in the back.
He's got his profile up and I'm hoping that the British fans have accepted that the position he's in now with the drug testing issues and can put it behind him. I've tried my best to just not talk about it in interviews because it’s pointless. One, he can't speak about it for legal reasons. Two, we’ll never see this 200-page dossier and he can never give us an explanation about how it actually got in the system. You know what I mean?
I don’t want to get too into it. It's all old news, it’s boring now for me. And there's many fighters before Conor Benn that failed drugs tests that have gone on to win world titles and become massive legends and become Hall of Famers. So just leave Conor Benn alone, he's done his two years, he's paid his money out and now he's just been in a fight where you know the guy is serious about boxing. So he deserves his respect, deserves his credit. Now shut the f**k up about his drug test and let him get on with his career. Let it go now.
Another L for Eddie and Matchroom. Are they in danger of being marginalised or are they still in the mix?
Carl Froch: Well he's got a big team in America, Matchroom. Eddie Hearn works really hard, he's a grafter. And boxing goes many ways. It’s who you sign and I guess his biggest nemesis is Frank Warren. And Frank Warren is obviously absolutely smashing it and fair play for him. He's been around the sport for years and he's a very shrewd businessman.
He's got most of the top fighters. These people are going over to him. I think Leigh Wood is fighting soon and he’s with Frank Warren. He's on DAZN now. He's got a good relationship with the Saudis and boxing is the ultimate winner. I mean, I'm not interested in Eddie Hearn or if he's lost another fighter. He's having a bad run. But he’ll be alright. He’s got a business called Matchroom Sport. He's got darts and snooker too. I'm sure he's worth close to a billion quid. I'm sure he is not gonna be crying his eyes out.
He's a man with a big ego. And he is a man who is driven and likes success. So it will dent him a little bit or dent his confidence. It will hurt his ego a little bit. But I'm sure he is not really that bothered. I think he'll be fine. He's not running the show in boxing anymore. He is not the main guy. He was for a while and now he’s not.
"Jake Paul can't mention my name"
He needs Anthony Joshua to come back with a big performance.
He needs a miracle if he needs AJ to come back. AJ can't fight anybody except for finished past their best boxers, he’s finished. It's gonna be Tyson Fury if he decides to come out of retirement. It's the only fight that makes any sense for AJ. If he fights Dubois again, he is going to get splattered.
Look how bad that first fight was. He’d have no confidence coming back into the ring. And that was his last fight as well.
Jake Paul apparently dismissed a question asked at him the other week, if the both of you would fight. Is that fight dead in the water? Have you heard anything from Jake?
Carl Froch: Jake Paul cannot bring himself to mention my name anymore, or answer anymore questions because he knows the more he talks… and don’t forget, he started talking about me. I can't be arsed to get gloved up against anybody. But I'll happily step in and knock his teeth down the back of his throat just for the sake of boxing. But he now doesn't mention me because he knows when, when I respond back.
It all goes against him and everyone just says, you've got no chance against Froch, even 10 years retired, he’d absolutely hammer you. He knows I’ll happily fight him. So he's thinking, what can I do? Just shut Froch down. Let's pretend I don't know who he is..Jake Paul’s a little b**ch, man. He's not gonna fight anybody. He fought Mike Tyson.
What a disgrace. He’s proved nothing, he's a waste of time. He’s a money making machine. But like I've said, and like I point out to him on social media, you will never ever have the respect of the boxing community. One because he can't fight. Two because he won't fight anybody. What he does try and fight he looks f**king crap, who’s watching that? All his little demographic watch it. I think of anything more boring than sitting up watching Jake Paul fight. He's f**king useless. It's f***ing bad.
"Harlem Eubank is a good fighter"
Billy Joe Saunders said that if he was to come out of retirement, he’d want a ‘warm up’ fight against Chris Eubank Jr.
Carl Froch: He’s putting himself in the mix isn’t he. But if he’s talking about fighting Chris Eubank Jr, f**k knows how he’s going to do 160. I don't think Billy Joe Saunders has any intentions of fighting and if he does it won’t be against Chris Eubank Jr.
Fair play to Chris Eubank’s guy Napper, he stood his ground when Billy Joe Saunders tried to come into the locker room causing trouble. I thought Billy Joe made himself look a little bit stupid. But he is not bothered, he is what he is. He’s done some dodgy things. But he tried to get in there. He knew he probably couldn’t get in but thought he might be able to cause some chaos outside. So I don't like that, thought it was out of order. But I get it. I understand it.
What about Harlem Eubank against Connor Benn? Continue the family feud?
Carl Froch: He’s a good fighter and Chris Eubank Sr was talking about Harlem fighting Conor Benn a few years ago, but no one's really interested in the nephew fighting. We've had the fight. I think the whole scenario, whatever you want to call it is over. It's finished. The bigger man beat the smaller man in a close fight. The right man won. Eubank was not at his preferred weight and still got the job done.
If they did another fight, I think they’d sell out 70,000 again.
I think you’d be surprised. Because the people were interested in seeing it for the first time and the element of the unknown. Now everybody knows what's going on. If that was a split decision draw, you've got an instant rematch. If Conor Benn would've got the decision, Eubank would've come back and said, ‘listen, I'll fight you again, but I'm not doing a 10 pound rehydration clause.’ But now, because it was a conclusive win I don’t think we’ll see a rematch. No one's arguing about the win except Tony Bellew, who made himself look stupid talking about Conor Benn saying he won easily. I don’t know why he says stuff like that. I know he’s loyal to the core, but there's biases going out of control. Nobody was saying that it was a robbery.
We know exactly where it’s coming from as well. He’s friends with Eddie Hearn, he’s being loyal to his boy. I love Tony Bellew, he's great. He’s a top guy, a great pundit and analyst. He knows boxing inside and out, and he always comes on my channel. We’ve done rounds and rounds of sparring, so we've got this profound respect for each other. We're mates, we’re colleagues.
"Dubois can shock the world"
Daniel Dubois vs Oleksandr Usyk has been confirmed for July. Can he do the business and shock the world? Surely has a better chance this time.
Carl Froch: Can he shock the world in one word? Yes. He can because Usyk is 38. So I was 38, 9 years ago, but I know how he feels, I retired at 36. I was nearly 37. I was a month away from my 37th birthday when I chinned Groves at Wembley in front of 80,000 people.
I went on to become an international boxing Hall of Famer and that was 11 years ago. And it was hard for me. I did the weight easy really. I say easy because I'm not lying around in a spacesuit trying to take weight off. I'm actually eating all meals and doing it properly like Hall of Famer world champions do it. People like me, Roy Jones, Floyd Mayweather all did it properly and didn’t struggle with weight. They get down to the weight, they do it properly, they get in the ring on point and it's not easy, but it's not traumatic like some of these guys make it. And I just think Usyk at 38 years old.
Although he’s not got the issue with weight, because he’s heavyweight, you can weigh what you want. You're still slowing down. Still got reflexes that are diminishing. He still got old joints and old bones. And Dubois is young, fresh and hungry. The first fight was close and Dubois was unsure of himself. He’s then gone and flattened AJ had a couple of fights with Jarrel Miller, looked good against Filip Hrgovic and you’ve got to say that Dubois is a different machine. Time waits for no man as the saying goes and I just think that this is a fight. It's exciting, it's a good fight. You've gotta make Usyk the favourite, but it is a fight that Daniel Dubois can definitely win. I don’t think Usyk should keep fighting and I remember saying last time, just retire. Once you’ve beat Tyson Fury, just retire, you’re done.
If I was putting percentages on it, I’d say this rematch is quite close to even, so I'd probably give Usyk the edge 55/45. Because if he gets clipped on the head, Daniel Dubois will throw those shots. He's gonna get close to him. But Usyk’s got those superior boxing skills and that jab and that slick movement. But can he do that now for 12 rounds at 38 years old? Probably not. So he's gonna have to stay in range a little bit more. So it's a really interesting fight.
What round was the first one stopped in? Do you remember?
Carl Froch: I think it was eight or nine. Got hit with a jab and Dubois half gave up, and he got a bit stick for it. He’d exhausted himself. He landed that good body shot, called as a low blow. I dunno. Then he let himself down a bit by staying down. He should have got up and took some more hits because by staying down till nine, people look at that and say, ‘go on, get up.’ Yeah, I don't really like saying somebody bottled it. There's a fine line between getting up on eight and getting up on nine, but there's also a decision you make in your head, as to whether or not you wanna continue fighting as soon as your arse hits that canvas.
Your saying to yourself, ‘f**king hell, I didn't see that coming’. This guy's too good for me. I don't fancy it. Or your arse hits the canvas and you think, ‘cheeky f**ker, I’m gonna get you back’. And that's exactly what I thought when I got knocked down by George Grove. Then I won. I'm never gonna stay down. I was telling the referee I want to fight. I'm alright. I was all over the shop. It was the same with Jermiane Taylor. I was on the floor thinking, took me eight seconds because you've done me there. Took me eight seconds. I stood up and I thought, alright, let's go. It's time. It's you or me. Let's finish it. And the bell came in at the right time.
And then I just got my composure. Got on with a job. But not everyone's built the same. Some people don't fancy it when it comes on top and showed that element of, maybe it was a bit naive, but just that negativity and that lack of self-belief. Now I think he's got rid of that. He's been through that. He's experienced it, and now he's like, right, I’m World Champ. Made the money. Finished AJ with style, and the crowd was behind him. Had a kind of war with Jarrell Miller. It was a great fight. I’d feel bad for Usyk if something goes wrong, because Usyk is the far superior athlete.
Far more skilled, talented fighter, big champion, undisputed cruiseweight champ. For him to live on to 38, 39 in the ring, and they get beat by someone like Dubois, who's a good fighter and he’s still developing, they can get even better. It would be a terrible end to Usyk’s legacy. And for what? For some graveyard money? He’s a man of God, so hopefully he's fighting for the right reasons.
Eddie Hall secures stunning 27-second MMA knockout against strongman rival Mariusz Pudzianowski - five-time World's Strongest Man winner
Carl Froch: He’s got some fire in him. Get stuck in. Pounds away with the hammer fist. I'm impressed.To go from being what he is, a strongman champ. You need a bit of endurance. I’d break my back.
Leigh Wood finally back in action next weekend for the first time since his win over Josh Warrington in October 2023 vs The Belfast Apache Anthony Cacace. What’s your prediction?
Carl Froch: In Nottingham on DAZN. Hopefully I'll be there. Hopefully I'll be working the broadcast. No worries if not, because I have Froch On Fighting, the best channel in the business. I'll be there.
Leigh Wood is the Sheriff of Nottingham, he's keeping the boxing team alive in this city. His fight with Frampton should have been at The City ground, Eddie Hearn couldn't do it for him. Oh yeah, there was a bit of a, yeah. Didn't happen. Is now signed with Frank Warren. Looks like Warren pulled a little fight out the bag from him. Cacace is a good fighter. So it's a tough fight.
"Calzaghe was a top fighter"
And on the Undercard, another Nottingham fighter, Ezra ‘The Canon’ Taylor, know anything about Ezra?
Carl Froch: I don’t know a great deal but he’s certainly tipped to do good things.
Anthony Yarde and Lyndon Arthur ran it back for a third time, isn't it?
Carl Froch: Close fight. I feel like Lyndon Arthur didn't work hard enough. He was in there, he was picking his shots nicely. Yard, again, had more work rate, fast hands, tip-tap, finding shots. Both are good fighters and I like watching them. I like that quite stylistically. Pleasing to the eye.
We asked George last week how the fight would’ve gone between you & Calzaghe, Groves said “Calzaghe would’ve smashed him”. How do you think the fight would’ve gone?
Carl Froch: Well, you can say that somebody will beat me 'cause I'm not unbeaten. The only guy I’ve not beaten in my whole career is Andre Ward, who’s never been beaten by anybody. There was one guy that's beaten me and that was on points, two of the judges were 1 15, 1 30.
So he’d beaten me by one round, against the guy who was an Olympic Gold medalist, never lost a fight since he was 12, retired undefeated. He was part of the Hall of Fame, I'm sure. So to say that Calzaghe would've smashed me after Calzaghe got smashed by Robin Reed. Got flattened by Cabaret Celine. Give Mario Viet a rematch, but then didn’t rematch Robin Reed and Mario Viet, I mean, he can be f**king useless. I won't give Calzaghe stick.
Calzaghe is a great fighter, unbeaten. He's been in a couple of tight fights, but most people are. I had a couple of close fights and he got the nod. But he wouldn't smash me would he? The Cobra don't get smashed. Calzaghe might have given me a really tough fight, real hard nights work, but he might have ended up getting smashed himself walking onto one.
And let's not rip the arse out of Joe Calzaghe. I’ve got nothing against him. He was a top fighter.
Is there a chance we could ever see the fight?
Carl Froch: No, because he won't fight! Turki Al-Sheikh offered him millions of pounds to fight me now and he turned me down. Because he knows the script! He’s not stayed in shape.
Listen, Calzaghe, great champion, top fighter, got nothing but respect. But The Cobra don't get smashed by anybody. There’s only person getting fu**ing smashed, and thats George Groves.
We also asked him what would've happened if he had beaten you in that rematch. And he said he would've gone on to fight Andre Ward. And maybe Kessler. He reckons he could have unpicked the lock of Andre Ward 'cause Ward wouldn't have been able to get past his jab.
Carl Froch: He's always been a dreamer hasn’t he. He’s still dreaming. It's good to be a dreamer. What do they say? Ignorance is bliss.Just living in that world in your own head going through life happily.
Johnny Fisher against Dave Allen 2 coming up as well.
Carl Froch: Looking forward to it! Big John, big Bosh on CoinPoker. Best poker site in the business. It was good chatting with him. And he's out in Fuerteventura? He's in good shape. Sparring going well. Was it a draw in the first one?
Fisher got the controversial win.
He got dropped didn’t he. Clawed his way back, got the win fair play to him. Now he needs to make sure. But there’s levels in boxing. Dave Allan’s a good little fighter. Great little domestic dust up. When's that at?
I might go down for that one because I’m looking forward to that. I’d say that Fisher will get the job done. But Dave Allen, don't write him off. He’s old. He's not old old, but he's got experience. He’s got a good pedigree. If he takes it seriously, he could get the win.
"I love watching Ryan Garcia"
Wardley vs Miller Portman Road June 7th
Carl Froch: Big Baby Miller. He's a good talker Baby Miller. I liked him in the build up for the AJ fight, before he got popped. Now he's back. That's a tough fight that is.
Ryan Garcia against Ronnie Romero. Any excitement for that?
Carl Froch: Yeah! I love watching Ryan Garcia.Obviously he failed a drugs test and nobody really talks about it, but I like Ryan Garcia. I think he was part of a set-up. He was talking outside the box wasn't he and all of a sudden he fails a drugs test. And now he's back in line. I don't want to go to into conspiracies though. We don't want to do that. It’s crazy.
I've stopped trying to work out what actually happens in the real world. Stick to my own world and just live my life. Just healthy, clean, prosperous Keep my head to the ground and just concentrate and focus. Keep looking forward and not backwards.
Devin Haney vs Jose Carlos Ramirez which is all really leading towards a rematch, isn't it? Garcia Vs Haney
Carl Froch: Yeah, of course. He does a job, which he probably will. And then Devin Hayley comes through. That's a great fight. Dunno what weight it's gonna be made now. That fight was almost like a whitewash, wasn't it? And you don't expect that from Haynes, because Hayes's got a fast hand skill beating everybody like in style, but he’s in against a puncher, who’s got rapidly fast hands, but is naturally bigger in there.
So it'll be interesting to see what weight it’s made at, but this is a fight that's gotta happen, especially after failing the drug test after that win. Yeah, that's a fight I wanna watch.
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