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J9s

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makinazero
Joined: 02.09.2008

Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

Preflop: Hero is CO with J 9
2 folds, Hero raises, 2 folds, BB calls

Flop: (4.4 SB) J A K (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls

Turn: (3.2 BB) Q (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB raises, Hero folds

Results:

Spoiler

5.2 BB pot (0.2 BB rake)
Final Board: J A K Q
Hero mucked J 9 and lost (-2.5 BB net)
BB mucked and won 5 BB (2.5 BB net)

its too loose fold the turn to a unknow player on this heavy board?

makinazero


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3 replies
Dawnfall26
Joined: 30.07.2008

Hi!

Fold is super easy since...what reasonable hand do you beat.... wierd low pocketpair or float which decided to turn it into a bluff on turn...really unlikely.

But I dont even like turn bet since its obviously a bluffbet... the worst that will call on this flop are gutshots and even these came in on turn...to bet here would be to make Qx to fold but I think these hands will quite likely call once more so you need to double barrell with it...vs unknown player that seem too optimistic to me,just check and take a freecard which will be quite nice here. If river is 9 I call,if J its close and actually I like r/f.


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madorjan
Joined: 13.11.2009

Yeah, I think the most important thing is what Dawnfall touched that it is a bluffbet, and one with fairly low equity against a valueraising range, so I'm not sure why calling is even an option here. (That just shows inconsistent thinking in my mind...)

However, I think the question of betting the turn is far more interesting. From a balanced perspective restricting our bluffs to 99- here will result in us not vbetting any single pair hands or worse, which is a mistake IMO. If we want to bet every top pair+, which should be standard IMO, we have to bluff even our worse Qx hands here. Now exploitatively there are 2 sides of the coin. For one, he'll fold more than optimal on the flop, and this turn card hits his range, meaning we want to bluff less than optimal probably, on the other hand I think checkback/calling is worse than just betting to protect our hand against future bluffs, therefore if we don't want to checkback/fold, we should probably bet as a bluff against some better or split, and a lot of worse hands. So I think it's quite an opponent-dependant situation here, but as a standard play I like betting the turn and taking a free showdown (not because I ever think I'll win, but because I can't vbet enough on the river to justify bluffing this).


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Boomer2k10
Joined: 22.09.2010

I agree that if you bet this on the turn you can't bluff the river with it otheriwse your turn betting range = your river betting range

On the matter of the turn bet I'm pretty sure that even with a 38% Co copen we can have this as the bottom of your checking range and that still allows us to bet pairs of Aces or better for value, we have a LOT of Ts too.

It's a borderline hand for sure but I think my defailt would be to check the turn here

As played you can't possibly call when he raises you.


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