How long is the long run

100K

4K is nowhere near a good sample too see if you are running bad or just playing bad. 100K is what you should be looking for, as what JB said.

And 2,5 BIs isn't that much of a loss really in 4K hands.

Post hands in the evaluation forum (very important imo), ask for help and study!

Yeh, 100k is usually the sample I go for.

is fixed limit even beatable anymore they could be bots!

50k hand should give you a good idea 100k+ would be better

Long run = Life

what about tournaments?

Originally posted by Targetme
is fixed limit even beatable anymore they could be bots!

I think it is. There's tons of bad players at that level - if these are bots, they have to be the stupidest bots ever. Or luckiest.

I just have my doubts. Maybe I'm just playing bad. Dunno.

I was just wondering where is the right time to make some conclusions. 100k sounds good if only my poker roll lasts that long. Don't really wanna lose it though.

Originally posted by Mikus8
what about tournaments?

I've done pretty well on freerolls, not sure if good enough to win regular tournament/SnG games. Would still prefer to become good at one thing first.

post some hands in the relevant forums, if your playing bad dont wait 100k or lose your roll to find this out

Originally posted by kipperkalle
I was just wondering where is the right time to make some conclusions. 100k sounds good if only my poker roll lasts that long. Don't really wanna lose it though.

If you only make it there? What limit are you playing? What is your current BR?
If you lose 2.5 Big Stack Strategy buyins and are worried about having money left to make it to 100k, you probably are playing too high a limit.

what about lose with premium hands like AA and KK systematically cross a period of couple weeks (I mean lose with that every time, everyday for several days)?

Well, if that make you feel less lonely and with your own, I confirm that's happening right now to some1 in the world (me ♦ )

About how long is the long run, well, as you (Im sure) have hear already, it is too long!!!

All the best to you my friend and GL to the tables

P.S. I was going to forgot the best/important part of my reply, as mentioned already by other memebrs above, post some hands so, peoples may helps you better as sometime what we believe is correct isn't necessary the truth

It's really hard to say what the long run is. I used to think 50k hands but now I'm leaning closer to 500k hands. The problem is that during that time you improve and you will never get an accurate sample because your play will change in the time you play those hands...

But people seriously underestimate variance....

There are samples of 50k hands where I'm a decent loser and samples where I'm a big winner and I feel like I've been playing pretty much the same for both samples.... so all you can really do is just try to make the best decisions possible in every situation and try to improve.

Thanks people, will follow your advice as much as I can. I kinda from this thread that I should just concentrate on getting better and not worry too much about results now.

500k hand sample kinda puts it in perspective

Originally posted by PhoenixPhreak
If you only make it there? What limit are you playing? What is your current BR?
If you lose 2.5 Big Stack Strategy buyins and are worried about having money left to make it to 100k, you probably are playing too high a limit.

Playing FL 0.05/0.10. Don't really feel like dropping down, still have necessary BR to continue on that level. Not much difference with that anyway.

I have a similar problem at the moment, though I'm breaking even after 5000 hands so its not really the same.

It all depends if you THINK you are playing well or not.

TBH though if that was me having lost over $200 in that amount of hands I would be seriously questioning my play.

It may be your on a bad run but even so you shouldn't be losing THAT much playing 0.5/0.10 stakes in such a small amount of hands.

Maybe you should post some hands in the evaluation forum and maybe recap on some training videos just to double check your not playing like a complete moron. ♦

Originally posted by darkpenance0
I have a similar problem at the moment, though I'm breaking even after 5000 hands so its not really the same.

It all depends if you THINK you are playing well or not.

TBH though if that was me having lost over $200 in that amount of hands I would be seriously questioning my play.

It may be your on a bad run but even so you shouldn't be losing THAT much playing 0.5/0.10 stakes in such a small amount of hands.

Maybe you should post some hands in the evaluation forum and maybe recap on some training videos just to double check your not playing like a complete moron. ♦

It' more like $20, I would have gotten away hella fast if it were $200. Chart shows BB's not $.

[offtopic]
where can i find such graphs for myself?
[/offtopic]

Originally posted by streamXQQ
[offtopic]
where can i find such graphs for myself?
[/offtopic]

They are generated by programs such as Hold'em Manager

Regards,
--VS.

Very long.

Kinda feeling better and wiser.

Although there are many "why me" type of threads, having one all for myself has been pretty good for letting steam out. Thanks for encouragment and whatever else was offered here.