Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.
BTN: $50 (100 bb)
SB: $67.60 (135.2 bb)
BB: $64.74 (129.5 bb)
Hero (UTG): $81.81 (163.6 bb)
MP: $48.96 (97.9 bb)
CO: $62.46 (124.9 bb)
Preflop: Hero is UTG with K
K
Hero raises to $1.50, MP folds, CO raises to $4.50, BTN folds, SB raises to $12,
CO is 28/17/3 but his 3b co vs utg is 10%
SB is 17/15/7 but very small sample
Hero?
Hey Maritsula,
Conventional/popular advice ----> What? Fold KK preflop. Nooooooooo. Never.
My advice -----> Sure. Fold if you like. Nice to have a larger sample before making any hero folds, but as a general population read villain is likely very strong.
I'd probably wait for a larger sample, check for a very low 3bet stat (yes, it's relevant), and a non-existent cold 4bet history - and then I would fold. Even if it ends up being a very small mistake, the variance will be high, considering some opponents just have AA/KK in their range here only.
Originally posted by w34z3l
Conventional/popular advice ----> What? Fold KK preflop. Nooooooooo. Never.
If he's 100bb's deep I don't know,maybe u need a larges sample to fold this one...
I am not folding...
If u fold u can't lose...I've seen pp doing it with Ak just because has blockers to nuts.
i would be fine getting it in here. we dont know if sb has read on co 3betting somewhat wide here.
my question is how do we attempt to get it in here if we want to?
do we click it back or just shove it in? both moves obviously look strong, but does a click back look too much like KK+?
just a couple questions i have if we do decide to get in KK here deepish
Just to clarify - would not be folding here without more stats/info on villain
Speaking generally, the spot may be one where you could fold KK preflop, i.e nitty guy cold 4bet from blinds vs UTG open and has zero cold 4betting history that wasn't either KK/AA.
@yougotfelted51 - I guess we need to answer a few other questions here about our range first. Would we have any other hands aside from KK+ that we are min 5betting? Theoretically we probably should.
In practice most players won't, and in practice it probably won't matter unless opponent is very good. I'd likely shove, probably looks weaker, but I don't think it matters too much.
Vs a good opponent I guess we'd need to think about balancing min-5bet range or whether we even want a 5bet range vs cold-4bet in the first place.
min-5bet range is sick because 100 bb it is against mathemaitcs to 5bet-fold.
100 bb with KK is always stacking. No matter how neatty hi is, I have seen sick neats pushing 33 or 87s only because of weather or tilt.
There is no difference between 100 bb and 135 bb, the crucial difference starts with 150 bb when it is called *deep*.
Originally posted by pokerferrer
There is no difference between 100 bb and 135 bb, the crucial difference starts with 150 bb when it is called *deep*.
Even 100bb deep many players are opening a min 5bet range especially when 3bets/4bets are getting smaller all the time. It's just a lot easier to do so when slightly deep. Even that extra 35bb gives you a little more room to manouver.
