[Zoom] Riverspot with KK

Yeah, I would. Why did you check the river though, when you had been the aggressor on all previous streets?

I would bet again on the river.
As played you are calling and making a note.

Originally posted by nitrol
I would bet again on the river.
As played you are calling and making a note.

Yup. That was my point as well. If you're gonna bet first ever other street, you should do it on the river too.

Okay, point taken. I guess it's pointless in NL2, but if he has let's say a flushdraw, wouldn't we get the maxvalue by letting him bluff the river? I assume you guys b/f the river? What's your sizing on the river?

Originally posted by inceptioner
Okay, point taken. I guess it's pointless in NL2, but if he has let's say a flushdraw, wouldn't we get the maxvalue by letting him bluff the river?

Depends on player and board. Here he can have JJ-TT, Qx that might not bet but will call a bet.

Originally posted by MJPerry

Originally posted by inceptioner
Okay, point taken. I guess it's pointless in NL2, but if he has let's say a flushdraw, wouldn't we get the maxvalue by letting him bluff the river?

Depends on player and board. Here he can have JJ-TT, Qx that might not bet but will call a bet.

Well, you've got a pretty solid point there. Are we all agreeing that b/f river is the best option? I still want to hear somebody's opinion about the sizing on the river.

Around 20BB imo.

Hero has the initiative on PF, F and Turn.
On the river JT makes a straight.
No flushes are possible.
Hero has an overpair to the board.

Hero could Cbet the river with 30bb. This leaves an effective stack of (107.5 -53= ) 54bb in a 104bb pot.
However:
The board has a pair and Villain might have floated AA, QQ, 88 and 55. Hero could be check-raised. Since he is in front of V's range he should call the all in.

Hero checks and V overbets the pot to all in. The pot would than be 50bb + (107.5 -33= ) 74.5bb gives 124.5bb. To call costs Hero 74.5bb. This might be a fold.

So check-call is perhaps not the most +EV action if Hero is a cautious player it is --apart from folding-- the least expensive one.

Originally posted by wimNP
The board has a pair and Villain might have floated AA, QQ, 88 and 55. Hero could be check-raised. Since he is in front of V's range he should call the all in.

What kind of check-raise range is KK beating on the river?

Originally posted by inceptioner

Originally posted by MJPerry

Originally posted by inceptioner
Okay, point taken. I guess it's pointless in NL2, but if he has let's say a flushdraw, wouldn't we get the maxvalue by letting him bluff the river?

Depends on player and board. Here he can have JJ-TT, Qx that might not bet but will call a bet.

Well, you've got a pretty solid point there. Are we all agreeing that b/f river is the best option? I still want to hear somebody's opinion about the sizing on the river.

Bet/fold is my choice too. A bet in the range 0.20-0.25 will do it.

Originally posted by nitrol

Originally posted by inceptioner

Originally posted by MJPerry

Originally posted by inceptioner
Okay, point taken. I guess it's pointless in NL2, but if he has let's say a flushdraw, wouldn't we get the maxvalue by letting him bluff the river?

Depends on player and board. Here he can have JJ-TT, Qx that might not bet but will call a bet.

Well, you've got a pretty solid point there. Are we all agreeing that b/f river is the best option? I still want to hear somebody's opinion about the sizing on the river.

Bet/fold is my choice too. A bet in the range 0.20-0.25 will do it.

I would double that (or close) 0.4 - 0.45 or what as Matt said 20BB

I meant BB. 20-25 BB

U should bet this river, inceptioner.
Worse hands can call it to make a value bet worth it.

Originally posted by inceptioner
Are we all agreeing that b/f river is the best option? I still want to hear somebody's opinion about the sizing on the river.

Yes, b/f is the best option for me. Half pot seems a good sizing otr.

Originally posted by wimNP
The board has a pair and Villain might have floated AA, QQ, 88 and 55.

I dont think aces are on his range here.

How to explain you that CO sometimes can have AA here. If one of BTN, SB an BB is squeeze happy, then CO with a call creates a perfect opportunity for the squeeze.Then he can overall.

Sure I don't know?
I play these a lot and I don't understand why you only pushing with 3×BB with premium;
Most players hear are good and you will just let them in with that kinda play,
I have notes on loadz off this and
Bottom pairs are 6
Top pairs are 12
Sometimes the odds are completely disorder and you have too adjust,put colors
Not bragging but on this game on 2 tables I get 9 times buy in

Sorry not been harsh but you will be crunched like that you cannot show passive it is fatal cbet 1 2 3

I dont mind a check-call here vs the right villains. I've seen plenty of call-call-bet lines from people with tpgk or even tpbk on dry boards like this. It also lets you pot control against bluffy villains where you would feel compelled to call a river raise.

So it becomes a pot control and bluff catch vs thin value bet spot. The correct line depends on the villain. Without a clear read Im not sure you can claim a clear advantage to one line or the other.

Jaissica, ur line of thinking is really reasonable.
If I would choose the best line, would be betting... Thats cause the population tendencies of NL2. They tend to call/call/call w worse hands, making bet/bet/bet a great line for value. In contrast, they dont bet themselves much, and when they do... are w hands better than average.