88 on 634-flop

Nice hand, not sure why you post this one?

Originally posted by samni
Nice hand, not sure why you post this one?

Hahahahahaha...........I was a little bit unsure how to handle a sudden overcard on the turn.
So to ask in general:
How should I handle overcards that appear on the turn or river?

I believe you have two-ish options here. Bet turn, reevaluate river or checkback and call river. Standard I mostly go for betting turn so I keep the lead and keep control of the size of the pot. By checking this turn, you may induce a very big bluff on the river of which you will have a very difficult time calling it. Betting here often makes hands fold that have decent equity vs your hand like OESD's and if not, you want to charge them for drawing.

Also don't be afraid if one overcard hits the board. Alright, he will show up with AJ every once in a blue moon but it's not like he is having too many Jx hands in his range. If an A or a K hits the turn, it's another story though but still, you can easily rep the K or the A so even on those cards I'd might bet.

You should push preflop tbh.
As played, BBs hand is almost always weaker than yours because all hands that flop a set or overpair would shove preflop. MY guess is he has something like 54. Bet and not fold vs BB

We have still 18bb left. So pushing isn’t bad, but I would still raise most of the time here.
If we bet the turn we have I think a decent amount of fold equity, because he need to risk his tournament life here with calling and the J is most of the time a bad card for him as well.

Cheers,
SDK1987

With 18BB I shove 88, you rarely get a good flop like this with 3 undercards, what do you do if there are 2 over cards?

88 is more likely to flop a set than 3 undercards

Originally posted by slippyjim
88 is more likely to flop a set than 3 undercards

Interesting, can u prove this mathematically? For the record, not saying you're incorrect or anything, just curious about the numbers.

I think preflop you can go both ways. Pushing is definately +ev and unexploitable but if you have a fairly active table you can go for minraisecalling too. Most of the stacks behind are reshovestacks so we might just want to induce here. That being said 8's isn't the ideal hand to be inducing unless you see villians capable of shoving 6's over your openraise. In a 1$ I think that is quite unlikely so maybe a push pre is the best option.

What's the bottom of your openshoving range here? Do you openshove any pocket pair here?

I cant remember but I either read it somewhere or heard it when watching a video, I think one of Pulse's on youtube. I cant prove it mathematically but wherever it was I heard it I felt it was a trustworthy source

Personally at the micros I
Shove more than raise/call because people dont shove wide over your raise, so you hardly ever get to r/c with a hand like AQ or AK they are more likely to call a small raise & then often you play a hand OOP & if they dont fold to your cbet you lose 1/4 of your stack to a hand that often will fold to a shove

I only induce with big pairs QQ+, maybe JJ, even here with 18BB I'd be more tempted to shove AK than try and R/C because a weaker Ax often still calls a shove

I often will just 2X at final tables or ITM because on 888.es it seems to be easier to steal from people after the bubble, but I see so many weird thing plays at 888.es......

Not everyone will agree with me, but thats my thinking

Originally posted by slippyjim
I cant remember but I either read it somewhere or heard it when watching a video, I think one of Pulse's on youtube. I cant prove it mathematically but wherever it was I heard it I felt it was a trustworthy source

Personally at the micros I
Shove more than raise/call because people dont shove wide over your raise, so you hardly ever get to r/c with a hand like AQ or AK they are more likely to call a small raise & then often you play a hand OOP & if they dont fold to your cbet you lose 1/4 of your stack to a hand that often will fold to a shove

I only induce with big pairs QQ+, maybe JJ, even here with 18BB I'd be more tempted to shove AK than try and R/C because a weaker Ax often still calls a shove

I often will just 2X at final tables or ITM because on 888.es it seems to be easier to steal from people after the bubble, but I see so many weird thing plays at 888.es......

Not everyone will agree with me, but thats my thinking

You talk about 88 and the probability of flopping a set...How does the situation look like with other pp?
I guess the smaller the pair the lower is the probability of flopping three undercards.

There's 1815 in the pot already (don't forget the antes), I would just shove preflop.

Originally posted by Dominik12345
You talk about 88 and the probability of flopping a set...How does the situation look like with other pp?
I guess the smaller the pair the lower is the probability of flopping three undercards.

It will decrease accordingly for every lower PP, I dont know the actual maths so its hard to say exactly by how much

Originally posted by samni
I believe you have two-ish options here. Bet turn, reevaluate river or checkback and call river. Standard I mostly go for betting turn so I keep the lead and keep control of the size of the pot. By checking this turn, you may induce a very big bluff on the river of which you will have a very difficult time calling it. Betting here often makes hands fold that have decent equity vs your hand like OESD's and if not, you want to charge them for drawing.

Also don't be afraid if one overcard hits the board. Alright, he will show up with AJ every once in a blue moon but it's not like he is having too many Jx hands in his range. If an A or a K hits the turn, it's another story though but still, you can easily rep the K or the A so even on those cards I'd might bet.

Would you handle an A or K in the same way?

Originally posted by slippyjim
I cant remember but I either read it somewhere or heard it when watching a video, I think one of Pulse's on youtube. I cant prove it mathematically but wherever it was I heard it I felt it was a trustworthy source

Personally at the micros I
Shove more than raise/call because people dont shove wide over your raise, so you hardly ever get to r/c with a hand like AQ or AK they are more likely to call a small raise & then often you play a hand OOP & if they dont fold to your cbet you lose 1/4 of your stack to a hand that often will fold to a shove

I only induce with big pairs QQ+, maybe JJ, even here with 18BB I'd be more tempted to shove AK than try and R/C because a weaker Ax often still calls a shove

I often will just 2X at final tables or ITM because on 888.es it seems to be easier to steal from people after the bubble, but I see so many weird thing plays at 888.es......

Not everyone will agree with me, but thats my thinking

Sorry but I dont reall understand what you mean.

"Personally at the micros I
Shove more than raise/call because people dont shove wide over your raise, so you hardly ever get to r/c with a hand like AQ or AK they are more likely to call a small raise & then often you play a hand OOP & if they dont fold to your cbet you lose 1/4 of your stack to a hand that often will fold to a shove."

What do you want to say with that. I am the one who openraises, so what do you mean with raise/calling?

I wasnt talking about this hand in particular, I just mean in general at the micros I prefer to shove than to raise and expect people to shove a worse hand