PLO25 AA97r 3B OOP

AA do not call pre from BB. It´s an outdated approach before Solvers existed, way too passive as we know now.

The flop is from the mid-low wet category which solver cbets around 50% if following a mixed betting strategy. So after straight and monotone flops this board texture has the lowest c-betting frequency oop in 3bp´s. The more dynamic the flop, the more careful we have to be, because our range contains lots of Overpairs like AAxx.

The side-equity favours putting this AAxx-version into our betting range. The components accompanying our AAxx make the difference of our play, if we have nothing along we even check-fold AAxx under circumstances. Be aware those components working together have value but not by itself. The A♦: is not usable to bluff off our opponent from flushes on the next street but it works as a removal card blocking villain´s continuing range. Since our hand is so vulnerable I would go for full pot denying Equity. If you bet all of your range with the sizing you used (i guess it´s sth like 75%) that´s fine too imo as long as the Turn SPR won´t be much bigger than 1. The turn is pretty much a blank and I would 2-barrel stack-off aswell. Ofc the Kxxx 2pair combos got there but they do not compound enough hands of villains calling range to get out of the hand at that SPR.

I know this spot and also found it troubling when starting out playing PLO, you got ittle bit unlucky that villain made his 2pair but it´s a high variance spot at least you haven´t been drawing dead.

I would like to just call preflop. As played this might be x-c spot on flop. I think AA+nut gs+nfd blocker is too good to just x-f. But I am not big fan of betting really. As played K is kind of bad card imo. There is fair chance of it improving stuff like Tx and K high fd so I would just x-f. We have very low equity hand overall in spot where villain often has something to continue.

Originally posted by ghaleon
I would like to just call preflop. As played this might be x-c spot on flop. I think AA+nut gs+nfd blocker is too good to just x-f. But I am not big fan of betting really. As played K is kind of bad card imo. There is fair chance of it improving stuff like Tx and K high fd so I would just x-f. We have very low equity hand overall in spot where villain often has something to continue.

Solver is calling a few trash Aces like A♥:A♣:9♦:5♠:, A♥:A♣:7♦:3♠: or A♥:A♣:A♦:9♠: BB from MP (14%). A♥:A♦:9♣:7♠: is already a 3-bet though. ♠_biggrin: I would for the beginning just simplify it to 3-betting AAxx 100%. But it´s worth note-taking that we can call some rag Aces for balance purposes.

I checked solver and it is following a mixed strategy with rainbow AAxx. With the specific combo you posted solver does indeed check-call flop then check-folds ott. Be aware that with check-call flop we have to check-raise allin some of those rainbow AAxx combos like A♥:A♦:Q♣:Q♠: (maybe because we block that part of villains calling range that has straightdraws with Equity) and other hard to identify AAxx combos. Imo it´s way harder to execute but more accurate. Against a 50% turn bet we fold 37% (villain is supposed to bet 50% only otf ip, a quite unrealistic scenario in real game) and fold 57% of our AA against a pot-sized turn barrel. So we do have to check-fold a great amount of our pretty looking AAxx ott once we decide to check-call the flop. In general our check-call check-potting range primarily consists of AAxx that have a non-nutted flushdraw and or the backdoorflushdraw. I would say just make sure you do not check-call check-fold your AAxx habitually as a default play, that can become an expensive leak quickly.

Well I renewed plomastermind subscription today. Checked this spot preflop for PLO50 rake with 100bb, PLO500 rake with 100bb and 150bb to illustrate the spot.

PLO50, 100bb:

PLO500, 100bb:

PO500, 150bb:

So by comparing EV of different options we come into some conclusions:

- Higher the rake, more we should 3bet as rake will eat value of call
- Deeper we are in stacks, less we should 3bet. Especially hands that are tricky to play OOP with higher SPR.

We can see there that in plo500 in stars we are just calling AA97o with 100bb stacks EV being 0.12bb better than 3bet. But if we are 150bb deep call will have 0.62bb better EV which is pretty big difference. There is no 150bb deep sim in PLO50 but we can be pretty sure that 0.17bb advantage with 3bet will likely also turn to advantage of call when stacks get deeper.

Rake OP has in this PLO25 is potentially higher making 3bet potentially still best play. But its definitely not like "yeah just 3bet all AAxx" is optimal. In our hand stacks are 135bb deep roughly.

BTW in plo50 100bb deep trainer does call most of AAxxr:

PS: I will try to check postflop from solver view tomorrow at some point. Probably it will be mix of check-call and potting if I would guess.

Ok so I checked SBvsBU 3bet pot spot on J75ss flop from trainer to be able to check spot with 150bb deep as well.

With 100bb stacks:

With 150bb stacks:

So I chose J75ss as there was no T63ss and its somewhat similar flop. With 100bb stacks whatever we cbet half pot or full pot we are not folding to shove. 150bb deep though we are folding versus pot raise. In both cases if we check flop and face bet we are looking to x-c. But yeah passive approach is always in a way bit more tricky approach with these kind of hands.

BTW in plo50 100bb deep trainer does call most of AAxxr

if you filter out the 2Pairs, its 70% call, 30% raise

also depends more on the raise first in percentage and not only on position. if villain opens tight, like a utg first in, it would call 91% of AA rb and even fold more(all AAAx,AAAA), than 3bet.

Idk what stakes PLO Vision is programmed for, but I am sure that I personally will not study all those ranges anew once I reach a new stake. I make lot of simplifications like 3-betting AA 100% and when being ingame I can deviate anyways when I know what parameters influence the EV´s of those actions. It´s not like it would have a big impact how to play it against a 25/15 solid regular. And most bad players I am happy to hold the AAxx I am probably better 3-betting since pushing equity against loose ranges.

on plo5k it is calling 98,5% AA rainbow bb vs ep
vs CO aa97 won't be a 3bet too and only non-gapped connectors or stuff with a ten
only against btn it would raise here AA97rb oop

on plo50 we 3bet more because of the rake. and in theory, the folding ranges should be around 40%, which in reality is not even close and therefore i won't mind, especially for beginners, recommend keeping it small ball without multi-components hands, when we have a lack of foldequity and also a lack of rock-solid gameplan in 3bet pots where mistakes can become quite harmful.

recommend keeping it small ball without multi-components hands, when we have a lack of foldequity and also a lack of rock-solid gameplan in 3bet pots where mistakes can become quite harmful.

Also makes sense. When I see a regular having bad AAxx in his calling range I also feel like he is harder to play because Axx flops are not that capped anymore.

AA$ your attorney (AA off), I suggest you don't fold the aces... (Never ever in this situAATion.)

As you long as you love me, buddy.

Originally posted by BradNitt
on plo5k it is calling 98,5% AA rainbow bb vs ep
vs CO aa97 won't be a 3bet too and only non-gapped connectors or stuff with a ten
only against btn it would raise here AA97rb oop

on plo50 we 3bet more because of the rake. and in theory, the folding ranges should be around 40%, which in reality is not even close and therefore i won't mind, especially for beginners, recommend keeping it small ball without multi-components hands, when we have a lack of foldequity and also a lack of rock-solid gameplan in 3bet pots where mistakes can become quite harmful.

Yea but if you play PLO25 it could take some time before moving up to PLO5k.