The Shortdeck Diary: Chapter 2 - Becoming a semi pro

Originally posted by VorpalF2F
A Question about Stack Depth:
Often when playing 100a deep, you win a stack. Now when you play against another 200a (or more) deep opponent the risk/reward is much higher?

How do you adjust your ranges?

First of all you don't get it in PF anymore. Unless with AA or only if you saw villain do it with other stuff but that will be the real maniaks. I tend to be tighter OOP and more aggressive IP. So it means IP I Iso a bit wider, to call an Iso I don't adjust my range. But you will have to be much more carefull post flop. Unless I have good notes on villain I tend to leave the table when we are more than 200a deep.
Also important to notice the deeper you are the lower your winrate will become.

Originally posted by Fredjen
First of all you don't get it in PF anymore. Unless with AA or only if you saw villain do it with other stuff but that will be the real maniaks.

Using the GTO charts from sixplusholdem.com this is the response range from the HJ if UTG limps and MP raises 9a

This might be fine at 100a stacks, but puts too much at risk for deeper stacks — especially if you consider that MP's raising range looks like:

It doesn't seem to me that there is enough in MP's raising range to shove T9s for example.
I agree with your statement about the maniacs though — some of them shove extremely widely. The ones I find hard to deal with are the ones that raise over limpers by 5 or 6a — they almost always have a good hand that will hit a wide range of boards. This is a tough game!

Range according to solver when 200a deep action, UTG limps, UTG1 fold, MP pots (10a) HJ to act:

Solver is Shoving AA and AKo some of the time and balances it with AJs and ATs. (pbb because of blocking JTs and 9Ts). So GTO is never wrong but I think at the current state of the game no normal rec or reg will call with anything but the AA this deep.

Range of MP looks like this (according to solver):

You have to notice that MP will only ISO depending on a) UTG is fish b) aggressive players left to act c) Low chance of villain L/S. If you start to think on this lvl and adjust your play well I don't tink you'll be on 5NL...

Originally posted by VorpalF2F
It doesn't seem to me that there is enough in MP's raising range to shove T9s for example.
I agree with your statement about the maniacs though — some of them shove extremely widely. The ones I find hard to deal with are the ones that raise over limpers by 5 or 6a — they almost always have a good hand that will hit a wide range of boards. This is a tough game!

The problem with T9s or JTs is that you are never infront, you're never behind but in HU you will never have a 65-35 advantage. So you can say I start with shoving loser if they only call w AA, but than you need a A yourself. Also you have 2 players left to act and if one of them is 50 or 100a stack it will go in more lightly. So you see this situation escaltes rather quick. Exploitive this deep I would recommand to play post flop in pos as much as you can.

Last sessions of 2022 went really well

Originally posted by Fredjen

BR: 377,57$

Goal poker long term: Profit $1000 a month
Goal poker short term: Have fun, play 100k hands this year (currently 22.091hands but i'm 2 tabling now in stead of 4)
Goal health: Lose weight (currently 109kg) started gym 3 weeks ago (3 times a week is the schedule) and rearrange my feeding pattern.

The stated goals were rather wide because at the time I had no idea where it would lead to. Now we are 9 months later and I'm still here

Short term poker goal has been achieved, I had fun all the time (obv not laughing when I ran bad but overall good feeling about poker). Played 173k hands.
Goal health: Lose weight achieved (just before new years eve I was at 99,4) rearrange my feeding. This will actually be a lifetime achievement but I feel possitive about my last 6 to 7 weeks where I have followed my workout schedule and eating habbits.

Repport 2022:

Overall it's safe to say I ran really well (compared to EV). Also safe to say I have a lot to learn and struggled a lot to find a balance between playing and studying the game (this is still something I need to work on every day).
I have a study group with 2 people I met on the discord and have to say this has done wonders for my game.

You clearly see a difference (EV wise) before and after these meet ups:

About tournaments yeah I can't bring it up to play them. Unless I win I'm always frustrated when I bust out. So I will only play the 'shots of a lifetime' wich means the super huge fields in low main events or sunday million anniversary.

Played tournaments 2022:

BR at the start of 2023: $413,93

Goals 2023:

Keep learning and playing short deck, 10k hands a month
Keep up the set schedule for playing, studying and days not to play
Stick to the diet, I will not set a weight goal as the main goal is just be healthy
Keep working out.

Originally posted by Fredjen
Range according to solver when 200a deep action, UTG limps, UTG1 fold, MP pots (10a) HJ to act:

Solver is Shoving AA and AKo some of the time and balances it with AJs and ATs. (pbb because of blocking JTs and 9Ts). So GTO is never wrong but I think at the current state of the game no normal rec or reg will call with anything but the AA this deep.

Range of MP looks like this (according to solver):

You have to notice that MP will only ISO depending on a) UTG is fish b) aggressive players left to act c) Low chance of villain L/S. If you start to think on this lvl and adjust your play well I don't tink you'll be on 5NL...

Originally posted by VorpalF2F
It doesn't seem to me that there is enough in MP's raising range to shove T9s for example.
I agree with your statement about the maniacs though — some of them shove extremely widely. The ones I find hard to deal with are the ones that raise over limpers by 5 or 6a — they almost always have a good hand that will hit a wide range of boards. This is a tough game!

The problem with T9s or JTs is that you are never infront, you're never behind but in HU you will never have a 65-35 advantage. So you can say I start with shoving loser if they only call w AA, but than you need a A yourself. Also you have 2 players left to act and if one of them is 50 or 100a stack it will go in more lightly. So you see this situation escaltes rather quick. Exploitive this deep I would recommand to play post flop in pos as much as you can.

Thanks for the detailed post!
The thing with solvers is the idea of splitting your action and shove some times, raise some times, call sometimes etc.
I do that, but I make my decision based on observation of opponent's play, not just the numbers. Where I get into trouble is when I shove an "off" hand like ATs in your first image — I know it is meant to balance the stronger shoves, but still seems like it makes little sense. (I'm a nit I guess)

Originally posted by VorpalF2F
Thanks for the detailed post!
The thing with solvers is the idea of splitting your action and shove some times, raise some times, call sometimes etc.
I do that, but I make my decision based on observation of opponent's play, not just the numbers. Where I get into trouble is when I shove an "off" hand like ATs in your first image — I know it is meant to balance the stronger shoves, but still seems like it makes little sense. (I'm a nit I guess)

Short answer: Balancing is overrated on the micro's imo. My winrate is def higher when I shove tighter (for 50a that is).

1 BI away from taking a stab (again) at NL10 :heart::f_cool:

Originally posted by Fredjen
Nice upswing at the end of that graph.
That long gentle downslope before that shows discipline — well played!

Thx it's sessions like this i feel the mental work is paying off. When the spots are not good don't take them eventough it seems you don't play. At the end it was set to finish at 4pm and i kent it because i had household stuff to do. Back in the day i would just keep playing with all the arguing to follow. And if i would've lost it's doublet minus. So look at me 'growing'

I've been playing NL 25 shortdeck over the past few days, and I keep running into players playing like 55/50 and open raising 10a from every position. Do you see this at NL 5? To combat it, I tighten waaay up, and If I'm in a pot, I make sure I either have the nuts, or I'm drawing to the nuts before I bet against him.

After a few orbits of this, I moved to a new table. It seems to be working for this guy though — he seems to hit his target hand more often than he doesn't.

Here is an example of how he plays:
PokerStars, 6+ Hold'em No Limit - Button Blind $0.25 ($0.25 ante) - 6 players
Hand delivered by Pokeit

UTG: $26.95 (108 bb)
UTG+1: $17.55 (70 bb)
MP: $7.96 (32 bb)
MP+1: $61.28 (245 bb)
CO: $27.68 (111 bb)
BU (Hero): $26.52 (106 bb)

Pre-Flop: ($1.75) Hero is BTN with 6♦:T♦:
UTG raises to $2.25, 4 players fold, Hero calls $2

Flop: ($6) Q♥:7♦:6♣: (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($6) Q♣: (2 players)
UTG bets $2.85, Hero calls $2.85

River: ($11.70) T♥: (2 players)
UTG bets $5.56, Hero calls $5.56

Total pot: $22.82 (Rake: $1.14)

Showdown:
UTG shows J♣:K♦: (a pair of Queens)
BU (Hero) shows 6♦:T♦:
BU (Hero) wins $21.68

Originally posted by VorpalF2F
I've been playing NL 25 shortdeck over the past few days, and I keep running into players playing like 55/50 and open raising 10a from every position. Do you see this at NL 5? To combat it, I tighten waaay up, and If I'm in a pot, I make sure I either have the nuts, or I'm drawing to the nuts before I bet against him.

After a few orbits of this, I moved to a new table. It seems to be working for this guy though — he seems to hit his target hand more often than he doesn't.

Here is an example of how he plays:...

Yeah first off all you can't just pin the guy on only these stats. Important is to see if PFR is an OR or an ISO raise (or both) and the positions (you said from all positions). So lets assume he's always raising than you get this range:

So you need to search what hands are good against it and need to add the situation at hand. Like if you are on BTN against him from CO no limpers shove a lot. If you have regs in EP who openimped don't get to excited because they are pbb aware and limpshoving. So that was the 'it depends' answer.

But to give a more to the point answer I would shove all Ax hands against him even the off suit. Also shove TT+ and call only with the suited (semi) connectors. Post flop widen your value range like normally TP hand not so good in SD, against this one let's go. BTW prepare for swings

Second session from yesterday and first one on 10NL:

Why take shots at NL10? From your end of the year stats you are slowly getting ready to beat NL5 by a small margin. Why would you play NL10 and risk your BR again? Just because your roll allows it, doesnt mean you must move up. Especially if your BR mainly came from running hot in the first place. Just imagine how your BR looks if you run as much under EV as you ran above before.
Just my 2 cents, seems a bit irresponsible. Especially if you keep talking and should know about the variance this game brings