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PLO50 HU K955ds 3bet pot, turn line?

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ghaleon
Joined: 17.10.2007
BlackMember

First hand of the table. I did have some memory of playing with this guy earlier and thought he was somewhat maniac sort. But didnt have strong mental note on that.

Preflop is standard, no way to fold this strong hand. Flop I think call is also best option. If I had my draw component with mid or top pair raise would be fine but I think with my hand call just has best EV.

Turn give me top pair and second fd. So I have definitely some showdown value. SPR is close to 2. I think versus reasonable player we can get some better hands to fold with pot bet. On such dynamic board I would only have pot bet personally. Even if straight complete. Though this guy might not be one to fold that eagerly but we have so much going on that pot cant be that bad?

Game #1977100010: Table €50 PL - 0.25/0.50 - Pot Limit Omaha - 17:00:27 2023/11/02
Seated players
Seat 1: Keekkolo (€50)
Seat 2: Babyjanne (€50)
Blinds and button
Keekkolo has the button
Keekkolo posts small blind €0.25
Babyjanne posts big blind €0.50
Hole cards
Dealt to Keekkolo 5♠:K♣:5♣:9♠:
Preflop
Keekkolo raises €1.25 to €1.50
Babyjanne raises €4 to €4.50
Keekkolo calls €3
Flop Q♣:7♠:T♣: (9€)
Babyjanne bets €6.09
Keekkolo calls €6.09
Turn K♠: (21.18€)
Babyjanne checks
Keekkolo?


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6 replies
Coach
Kyyberi
Joined: 09.07.2010
Oldschool Grinder

Check is 100% quaranteed +EV move. Betting, I am not so sure. If he has missed the board, we don't really need protection and it's hard to get value. If he has better hand like 2 pairs, it should be somewhat connected hand (as he 3bet) and hit the board in some other way. Meaning that FE might be a bit low. And he could have a strong hand and we are forced to get the money in with lower equity.

What I have found out is that quite often when it's hard to say which one has significantly better EV (check or pot), in reality the EV is quite close to each other. If you had A or T instead of 9, I would pot. If you didn't have that gutshot, I would check. Now with the gutshot, I could go either way. In the beginning of a HU match (as this will be until 3rd one joins) I would value the information about his hand and check back. I estimate that when we see each other's hands, it would benefit me more than him.


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ghaleon Topic starter
ghaleon
Joined: 17.10.2007
BlackMember

Yeah this guy was indeed maniac as I potted, faced shove and ended up having 90% equity. Villain had some K542ss with low fd. So probably he was not folding any better or just overvalued his fd. Anyway I was more interested about default line. Someone had run monker on discord on this and there similar hands did go for pot bet. But yeah might be similar EV. One downside of check is also potentially facing river stab and unimproved we just have to fold imo.


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Mascherano95
Joined: 09.10.2010
Oldschool Grinder

What I have found out is that quite often when it's hard to say which one has significantly better EV (check or pot), in reality the EV is quite close to each other.

+1


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regie
Joined: 06.03.2008
Oldschool Grinder

I think so


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Just asking, but is this the nowadays hand discussions where you spliting hairs and doing solver sitsuations for marginal persentages and still ending for a result where hero has over 90% ev. Wow, ten years a go we just shove or fold. We shove if we had T insted of 9 ( in this hand) and re-think if we have less. :f_drink:


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Coach
Kyyberi
Joined: 09.07.2010
Oldschool Grinder

Well, versus opponent's assumed range hero doesn't have 90%.

Solvers have changed the discussion for sure. In almost every post solver output is brought to discussion at some point. To be honest, I am not so sure whether it's a good thing or not. Solver output has it's place, and solver has opened PLO strategy to whole new level. But still, in most hands posted here my personal opinion is that we shouldn't be looking solver output that much.

But on the other hand, if haven't set our standard strategy (or frame work as Jnandez describes it) we should use solver output as our standard strategy. So that's a starting point. But in my opinion even without hud we should deviate from solver strategy at least in 90% of the hands we play. That 10% is versus totally unknown. After few hands/orbits we should have some information from our opponents.

At lower stakes I have my standard strategy, so I would say I deviate from solver in 100% of hands I play.


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