[Closed] $50 Starting on Low Fixed Limit with a Long Term Tournament Millions Goal

make a decent amount without too much trouble or time.

there is always trouble and it's always time consuming.

Originally posted by Skyscrapers

make a decent amount without too much trouble or time.

there is always trouble and it's always time consuming.

Yes I know, what I mean is that I would be playing higher limits so when I win I win bigger and that I would be playing it less than now which is a good 6-8 hours a day, but even so I know what you mean and that wasn’t the best way to put it (the less trouble bit was just that I have to read and refer to charts a lot right now).

thers a long way in front of you.. best of luck!

FL FR is a good way to build a bankroll, but it gets REAL swingy when you reach to low-stakes SH like 0.5/1 and 1/2. Good luck!

"thers a long way in front of you.. best of luck!"

Thanks man, yeah I know there is a long way to go but at least I love the game!

“FL FR is a good way to build a bankroll, but it gets REAL swingy when you reach to low-stakes SH like 0.5/1 and 1/2. Good luck!”

Thanks as well, yours is actually one of the threads I read before I wrote this one. I just looked to check lol, but there are FR tables with 0.5/1 and 1/2 limits on stars, I think I will stick to them as I am comfortable on FR, unless of course you know something I don’t?

My first update:

A few things I forgot to say before are:
(1) I only play 1 table at a time (I started like that so I could learn properly with the game going slow enough to look up stuff in charts but now I just find I make more money doing it that way as I can watch the other players and make note on them etc)

(2) I had made about 60 FFPs and VVPs when I wrote my first post.

(3) the last $15 of my BR where from one day and after that, until about 4 days ago, I was on a downswing, my BR went down to about $70, it started when I tried to play multi-tabling and lost a lot as I was playing to many hands when I should have been tighter. I then went back to one table but had lost my game a bit but realising this I stopped playing and read, read and read and thought about it all and now I am playing well again! (I lost a lot during that downswing due to some bad beats which put me slightly on tilt and so, whilst I played only good hands still, I was unwilling to fold hands like pocket As even though I realised someone must have something better on the Turn, a mistake I will have to crack down on even though I really don’t like folding pocket As unless something really obvious has come up on the table like a flush etc.)

New Current BR: $90.93

New Current VVP/FFP: 225

I have played about 1 hour so far today but will be playing again later, I usually average about 8-10 hours a day now, usually from about 5pm to 2am GMT (when you’re up late you get a lot of really bad players on, not sure why)

Question:
My BR can have pretty big swings (like the downswing mentioned earlier), I usually put $5 on a table to play with and it sometimes goes down to as little as $2 but I almost always make at least most of it back if not all and more. I almost always break at least even with my BR but usually I’m up more than I came in with that day, I think I have only had about 2-3 days when I really broke exactly even or a little under. So my question is, should my swings be as large as they are, is it likely am I doing something very wrong in my game or is this kind of swing quite normal or in fact guaranteed (it is gambling after all) but as long as I am up, it’s ok? I’m not too worried as I am up! But if I could do better, I would obviously like to, so if any more experienced players have any input, please tell me.

Originally posted by boomshackalack
Thanks as well, yours is actually one of the threads I read before I wrote this one. I just looked to check lol, but there are FR tables with 0.5/1 and 1/2 limits on stars, I think I will stick to them as I am comfortable on FR, unless of course you know something I don’t?

The problem is that FR gets tighter and better at these stakes and SH is fishier. But I think if you play at Stars, it doesn't matter =). And of course, don't move to SH until you've mastered the basics of FL by playing FR.

edit: FL is swingy as hell. I remember losing almost half of my BR when moving to 0.25/0.5 FR. Dropped from $200 to $120 or something like that. That was also due to bad skills, of course. Don't worry about losing sessions, focus on every single hand. If you are not sure if you played the hand correctly, post it to the hand evaluation thread. I spammed it like hell with dozens of hands at the beginning, was really helpful ♦.

some other VERY important things you have to do:

watch FL videos
go to TerrorBlade's coaching and bomb him with questions
follow BRM
don't tilt, try to play your A-game all the time

Hi tavvi, thanks for your posts! I have been reading more of your blog and found a very interesting part about half way through where “Waiboy” told you to try not looking at your BR as it doesn’t really matter at low limits and it’s better to concentrate on your game. This is something that had never even occurred to me lol, but it struck me when I read not only how obviously clever it is but how much I actually look at my own BR, obsessively, and always have it on a pedestal in my room of poker (as most do I know). So I think I will try this for a week like the guy suggested and see not only if I can get over it, but how much it would help my game and concentration too! So I was just wondering how it went for you? Did you find it really helped your game? And did you wish you had learnt it earlier in your poker career?

As far as updates go, I only have one, I tilted massively and thought it a good idea to go HU against noobs, unfortunately, I was the noob having never done HU before I lost like $10 before I had even realised it wasn’t going so well lol, but it’s ok! I have about 2/3 of it back already by playing my usual one table FR and am NEVER doing that again (I say never, I mean not until I rule at FR and have learnt how you actually play HU

Actually I am also silver on PS now! So I can read more articles which is great. I also want to buy a new poker book, as there are loads and on all different things (or so they say) does anyone have any recommendations for books that would really help me where I am with FL FR low limit? Whilst I still read the basic stuff religiously still, I would quite like a more in-depth one.

Originally posted by boomshackalack
I have been reading more of your blog and found a very interesting part about half way through where “Waiboy” told you to try not looking at your BR as it doesn’t really matter at low limits and it’s better to concentrate on your game. This is something that had never even occurred to me lol, but it struck me when I read not only how obviously clever it is...

Wow. First time something I've written came across as either obvious or clever, let alone both at the same time. w00t!

As far as updates go, I only have one, I tilted massively and thought it a good idea to go HU against noobs, unfortunately, I was the noob having never done HU before I lost like $10 before I had even realised it wasn’t going so well lol, but it’s ok! I have about 2/3 of it back already by playing my usual one table FR and am NEVER doing that again

Rule number one: Play within BRM.
Rule number one: If you feel like you're tilting, stop playing immediately (or sooner) until you've gotten over it.
Rule number one: Study, study, study.

If you're ever unsure about something, refer to rule number one and you should be okay. ♠_cool:

BTW, HU is a rake machine - even if you're a killer shark monster and devouring the weakest of loose passives, you are going to struggle to beat the rake so PLEASE don't play it seriously until a. you know what you're doing and b. you're playing it at $3/$6 or better.

does anyone have any recommendations for books that would really help me where I am with FL FR low limit? Whilst I still read the basic stuff religiously still, I would quite like a more in-depth one.

TBH, the stuff on PS.com is all the essential stuff required to get you through to $1/$2SH. If I was going to invest some hard earned, I'd buy Stox's "Winning in Tough Hold'em Games" and stick it under the porn in my bottom dresser drawer until I had gotten through all the PS.com stuff and felt I'd like a different perspective and a bit more theory - ideally once you are flirting with $.50/$1 SH (ie approx $500 BR).

Good luck with the grind - BOOMshackalack!

Lol yeah I think it is great advice to stop checking my BR all the time, and I am just about to start my first session today so I will start right now with trying not to worry about it.

I have always had a problem with tilt actually, I can go for days with simply hitting average or up a bit then down a bit then up again and I just work like a machine (a machine who enjoys what he is doing though..) without going on tilt but then sometimes when someone who doesn’t even try to play well calls to the end then hits his magic card on the river which obviously makes me lose a big amount (in relation to my BR) gets to me. I am trying to stop this though, I have read some psychology articles and realised the signs I show before I start going on tilt so with some willpower I will stop right there!

Yeah I know PS articles are great, they have helped me much more than “Winning Low Limit Hold’em” by Lee Jones which is the only book I have actually read. I just want a book for two reasons: one is that when I read really in-depth stuff of any subject and don’t understand half of it (I found this when I was at school) then when I then read the more basic stuff, I see the answers to the things I didn’t get and because I had been thinking about the things I didn’t get more than I would if I just understood straight away, I learn whatever it is really really well compared to if I had just read up to it on an even climb, and two is that, well I don’t take my laptop everywhere so when I don’t have it I can read from the book.

Anyway, no I won’t do HU anytime soon believe me, it took me so long to get that money at this limit then so quick to lose it, just felt crap man. I can play FR pretty affectively anyway, especially if I get on a good table, about that actually, I choose tables by reasonably low % of players who see the flop (as I got sick of the 80% ones were everyone went in then at least one would hit a better hand than you) and an average pot about $1-$1.50 (.1/.2 FL) and with the most amount of people I have marked as good to get money off. Just wondering though, I have chosen tables that way by going on other tables and realising I don’t have as many times when I get rivered on tables like these, but is there any way of finding any even better tables (as not all the tables I choose do I win at).

When table selecting, higher % players to the flop is better. Why? Because there are more players making mistakes. When other players make mistakes we win.

To begin with it can be frustrating losing with AK to 72o on an A7x x 2 board, but you have to remember if you make a decision that wins you money 65 times out of 100, you will lose money 35 times out of 100. If you get sucked out on by someone chasing a draw without the odds to do so, this is a good thing for us as we win more money than we lose vs that opponent. Of course, when we lose 5 times in a row it can be difficult to comprehend that, but FL is a game of marginal returns. The more mistakes we induce, the fewer mistakes we make, the higher return we make (ususally expressed in terms of Big Bets (BB) per 100 hands).

So loose tables are better. Further, when you sit down, you should avoid sitting with the loosest or more aggressive players on your left. Try to have TAGs on your left and loose aggressive/loose passive players on your right. In this way you get to act after the aggro opponents with more information, and have the opportunity to isolate loose/weak players. If you end up in a bad seat in a game, leave straight away. It will help save some money and assist with avoiding tilt.

In essense it's easier to win money from loose opponents than tight opponents - although you do experience more variance you need loose players to help you beat the rake. A table full of tight players often aren't winning players because of rake.

Hope this helps.

I just had this hand, it came after a few loses against fish, I just wanted to know if you think I did anything wrong, I mean reraising with it in bb was ok and then raising again post flop was ok as there were no over cards and I was the aggressor pre flop, but then when I get this reraise I think maybe he hit 2 pair or 3 of a kind so I decide just to call down unless the diamond or an over card comes maybe. But here is my question, seeing as there is no over card and the diamond hadn’t come yet, should I have been raising it all the way (not sure if he would have folded, I doubt it with that reraise but maybe raise for value as I have highest pair despite the aggression from him?) What do you think?

Known players:
[tg]Position_Stack:hands/vp$ip/RaisePreflop/AF/WTS/ORL/BBvsSteal/W$SD;Hero$4.85:///////;UTG2$12.66:26/65 /27 /2.1/38 /67 /-/67 ;MP1$4.44:19/53 /5 /1.6/40 /-/0 /25 ;MP2$4.00:15/40 /13 /0.6/17 /-/100 /0 ;BU$3.93:19/42 /0 /0.2/25 /0 /-/100 ;[/tg]
0.1/0.2 Fixed-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Elephant 0.69 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

Preflop: Hero is BB with J♠, J♥
UTG1 folds, UTG2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 raises, 2 folds, BU calls, SB folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, BU calls.

Flop: (15.50 SB) 9♦, 3♣, 6♦ (5 players)
Hero bets, UTG2 raises, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, BU folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (10.75 BB) 2♥ (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG2 bets, MP2 calls, Hero calls.

River: (13.75 BB) 8♠ (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG2 bets, MP2 folds, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 15.75 BB

Results follow (highlight to see):
Hero shows a pair of jacks (Js Jh)
UTG2 shows two pairs, eights and sixes (6h 8d)

UTG2 wins with two pairs, eights and sixes (6h 8d)

Oh yeah, I forgot, complete river suck out, I found myself laughing with mirthless laughter.

Originally posted by boomshackalack
So I think I will try this for a week like the guy suggested and see not only if I can get over it, but how much it would help my game and concentration too! So I was just wondering how it went for you? Did you find it really helped your game? And did you wish you had learnt it earlier in your poker career?

Not caring about money is really difficult. The challenge was just a small step towards it. I highly recommend not looking at your BR or graph while playing, this is one of the biggest mistake I made at the beginning. If you have PokerTracker, you can block your buy-in at each table with HUD so it affects you even less. I know there are also some 'tilt-blockers' available for downloading around the internet.

Yes, the challenge sure improved my game, mostly psychological aspects of it.

It's impossible to just suddenly "stop caring about money", first downswings hit really hard. But all that matters is making the best decisions. Money will come as a side effect. Just focus on improving your game (SPAM THE HAND EVALUATION THREAD!!).

edit: You have to 3bet the flop in this JJ hand, you're almost always ahead there. When capped on the flop or raised on the turn or river, just call down.

Thanks for your feedback, yeah I have started to minimize elephant while I play and only look at it when I have a big win to keep my mood up (a sort of starters compromise, soon I won’t look at it at all), although elephant doesn’t do a block buy-in that I can find.

Ok I will remember that when I get another over card pocket pair! Thankfully it didn’t make me go on tilt though, I almost did because of that and others but I really worked hard to keep my cool and I succeeded which I am really happy about! (Irony? No? Ok, lol)

One last thing, and the reason I replied so fast, I just had an awesome bit of luck, I mean I must have made a sacrifice to the poker gods at some point in my life that I was unaware of or something, ok here goes:

I have started only playing the highest % of players preflop and high average pots tables (thanks Waiboy, that was definitely the right thing as you already knew) and was doing sort of alright except the hand I put on a little while ago, then something weird happened, I was joining the waiting list of other tables when my table pocked up and I clicked call by accident, I was like “oh for god sake” as it was a T2o, then on the flop, well you can see bellow, but it is without a doubt the biggest pot not only I have won but that I have seen on .1/.2c FL!!!!! It came to $9.45!!!!!!!

Known players:
[tg]Position_Stack:hands/vp$ip/RaisePreflop/AF/WTS/ORL/BBvsSteal/W$SD;Hero$4.50:///////;UTG1$3.95:23/70 /0 /0.3/39 /-/-/29 ;MP1$1.69:33/58 /9 /0.5/42 /0 /-/25 ;MP3$4.39:23/87 /0 /0.5/26 /-/-/33 ;CO$4.21:22/68 /23 /2.1/41 /-/-/43 ;BU$4.85:71/24 /8 /3.0/10 /25 /0 /0 ;[/tg]
0.1/0.2 Fixed-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Elephant 0.69 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

Preflop: Hero is BB with T♥, 2♣
UTG1 calls, UTG2 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO raises, BU 3-bets, SB folds, Hero calls, UTG1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, CO calls.

Flop: (18.50 SB) 2♠, T♦, 9♦ (6 players)
Hero bets, UTG1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 raises, CO calls, BU 3-bets, Hero caps, UTG1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, CO folds, BU calls.

Turn: (20.25 BB) 3♣ (5 players)
Hero bets, UTG1 calls, MP1 raises, MP3 3-bets, BU folds, Hero caps, UTG1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

River: (36.25 BB) T♣ (4 players)
Hero bets, UTG1 raises, MP1 folds, MP3 calls, Hero 3-bets, UTG1 caps, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 48.25 BB

Results follow (highlight to see):
Hero shows a full-house, tens full of deuces (Th 2c)
MP3 shows two pairs, tens and nines (9h 2d)
UTG1 shows two pairs, tens and fours (4s 4c)

Hero wins with a full-house, tens full of deuces (Th 2c)
♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ ♦ and a little
INSAAAANE I KNOW

wooooooooow 48 BB, sick ♦

edit: i wouldnt cap the turn, you're too often beaten there by higher two pairs and sets

QUESTION:
If I have a good hand preflop (say AKo) and raise and get called by one person, I am in let’s say early position so am the first to act postflop, I countibet out even though I don’t hit the flop (assuming the flop isn’t too scary so I can assume he hasn’t hit either) and he calls instead of the preferred fold. Now when the turn comes and I don’t hit on that either, do I now check (which would show weakness and no doubt induce a raise which could, or could not be a bluff meaning that I would probably have to fold as it would be 2bb) or should I bet another 2bb out and hope for the best? I think I should check/fold, but it is a situation I have found myself in quite a few times and it never feels right, I can’t help but think I am doing something really wrong and wasting bets, surely more experienced players have a usually way of dealing with this as they must have seen it even more than me obviously.
(one last thing, I have in my earlier days of FL simply raised to the river if he only calls, hoping for the fold or an A or K, but then that just wasted so much when I didn’t hit. I thought I had to cut back and despite them being the best overcards, if I have nothing more than A high I should fold, so I do, sometimes on the flop, sometimes on the turn, or river if I can see it for free)

As I am writing this, I may as well have a quick update. With that biggest pot so far I posted earlier and two big wins in a row with KK then AKo, my BR is now $94.16 which is only about $1 less than my highest point so far, so I’m happy! Also, my VVPs and FFPs are at 287.

Oh and also, yeah that hand was sick ♦ I am still really happy about how it went but I know the cap on flop and turn where mad with only 2 pair against other raisers who should have had trips if they hadn’t of been as insane as me at that point, but all turned out well and I shall learn not to get carried away with betting my own hand without just as much thought on the other persons hand!

If you're against one player with AK, it's usually easy bet flop, bet turn. Then decide again on the river. Against a fish a common line is check/call on the river, if you think he has not hit and might try to bluff with busted draws. But I suggest you to post the hands you have problems with to this section: https://forums.pokerstrategy.com/forum/board.php?boardid=1383
There are professional judges helping you for free, other experienced players from our forum can also more easily answer you there.

I’ve played a few hours today but haven’t finished yet, however I would just like to share with you all this completely insane guy I just won some money off, I lol’d so hard:

Known players:
[tg]Position_Stack:hands/vp$ip/RaisePreflop/AF/WTS/ORL/BBvsSteal/W$SD;BB$9.89:05/80 /0 /6.0/50 /-/-/50 ;Hero$5.70:///////;[/tg]
0.1/0.2 Fixed-Limit Hold'em (10 handed)
Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Elephant 0.69 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A♦, T♦
4 folds, Hero raises, 4 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) K♠, A♣, 4♥ (2 players)
BB bets, Hero raises, BB calls.

Turn: (4.25 BB) 9♦ (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

River: (6.25 BB) 6♠ (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.25 BB

Results follow (highlight to see):
Hero shows a pair of aces (Ad Td)
BB shows high card ace with king kicker (2d Qd)

Hero wins with a pair of aces (Ad Td)

♦
Anyway, I think I played it well, I was worried about a AQ or AJ which is why I called down the turn and river (idk, should I have reraised them for value as too? i only reraised the flop as it was a cheaper way of finding out where i was) but the hand he actually had was just bizarre lol

I would play the standard line here, that is, call flop/raise turn for value. If he is an aggressive idiot, it is even better.

Learn and master this article, it'll help you a lot:

http://www.pokerstrategy.com/strategy/fixed-limit/944/1