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[Closed] PLO5 KQT9s multiway C/R v aggro post flop villain

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Waiboy
Joined: 18.09.2008

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
PL Omaha $0.05(BB) Replayer
SB ($10)
Hero ($5)
BTN ($18.96)

Dealt to Hero 9♥ T♦ Q♥ K♠

BTN calls $0.05, SB calls $0.03, Hero raises to $0.23, BTN calls $0.18, SB calls $0.18

FLOP ($0.72) 8♣ 3♦ J♣

SB checks, Hero bets $0.40, BTN calls $0.40, SB raises to $2.32, Hero folds, BTN folds

SB wins $1.80

SB 15/9/4.3/128, flop AFq/AF 47%/4.5
BTN 74/5/4.0/133, bet flop v missed cBet 45%

Check/fold flop without a pair/FD (assuming BB C/R here no matter how we play)? Even v a bare flush draw our equity is poor.

Or can we check/call (assuming BTN bets, SB raises 100% of the time) with (I think/hope) 9 nut outs/4 non nut outs and a dodgy nut BDSD on a non :club: A/K (say 1 out for the BD draws) intending to C/F turn without hitting a nut out? Sounds weak logic so I guess no?


5 replies
VisuLatvijai
Joined: 15.02.2007

I think you must make bigger bet on the flop. In this spot I will make at least 0,50$ bet. And if somebody raise me I usualy folding because somebody probably have flush - draw.


Ribbo
Joined: 25.06.2010

I like your bet on the flop. You want this hand to stay multiway as you really don't have that many outs to the nuts and anyone who raises you has you in trouble as you have zero showdown equity.

You need to hit your straight and you need the flush to stay away obviously, we don't want to bet big here and get called as it puts us in an awkward spot on the turn having to bluff into someone who may be sandbagging a big hand.

Sometimes on this flop, if I know someone is particularily aggressive and has position on me, I will just check call this flop and hope to keep it multiway as that is where my value is.


Waiboy
Joined: 18.09.2008

Originally posted by Ribbo
You want this hand to stay multiway as you really don't have that many outs to the nuts and anyone who raises you has you in trouble as you have zero showdown equity.

You need to hit your straight and you need the flush to stay away obviously, we don't want to bet big here and get called as it puts us in an awkward spot on the turn having to bluff into someone who may be sandbagging a big hand.

ZOMG, I think I'm learning stuff. Almost exactly my thought process at the time. :f_eek: I figured though that with zero showdown equity I was better bet/folding having only committed the $0.40.

Sometimes on this flop, if I know someone is particularily aggressive and has position on me, I will just check call this flop and hope to keep it multiway as that is where my value is.

Well, this villain, as it turns out, loves to C/R as a squeeze and has a ton of bluffs in his C/R range, and will fire a second barrel - I guess he views flop calls (correctly) as weakness? So, in position, we're still in bet/call mode?

Or to save some grief (and to hopefully keep it multiway) is check/call a better play v these specific opponents? Or would you still go with a bet/call just because position rocks so hard (ie we can get away from turn barrels UI, ship teh moniez with teh nuts and likely pretty decent implied odds)?


Ribbo
Joined: 25.06.2010

Rainbow board or wrap with flush draw and i'm bet/shoving. Give me wrap with top pair, i'm probably also bet/shoving.
The problem here is that you raised preflop so it's hard to represent a set of jacks or eights here, which means often someone is going to semibluff raise you when you bet the flop, and all of those hands have you in trouble. So to avoid that, sometimes you just check call the flop.

If the flop had come AJ8 and you had KQT9, then this is a much easier hand to cbet as people aren't going to want to semi bluff you here with a flush draw as they would think you have hit that flop quite hard.


Waiboy
Joined: 18.09.2008

Sweet. Thank you!