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Holidej
Joined: 03.05.2011

Honestly, I made that bad pre-flop call because I was tilting. But the question is about post flop play. I think I overplayed flash draw. On flop I called that big raise, because theoretically I have implied odds, especialy against two players, right? Now, on turn both players pushed, and I get ~3:1 pot odds, with my flash draw+gutshot I can call, right? But still I have feeling that I overplayed it :rolleyes:

Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:

Play hand

$0.02/$0.04 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)

Known players:
[tg]UTG1$0.21:///////;UTG2$2.39:///////;MP1$4.21:///////;MP2$1.36:///////;MP3 (Hero)$4.04:///////;CO$3.74:///////;BU$4.86:///////;SB$4.02:///////;BB$1.20:///////;[/tg]

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 7:s, K:s.
UTG1 folds, UTG2 calls $0.04, MP1 folds, MP2 raises to $0.12, Hero calls $0.12, CO calls $0.12, BU calls $0.12, SB folds, BB calls $0.08, UTG2 calls $0.08.

Flop: ($0.74) 3:s, J:s, 9:h (6 players)
BB checks, UTG2 checks, MP2 bets $0.12, Hero calls $0.12, CO folds, BU raises to $1.19, BB folds, UTG2 calls $1.19, MP2 folds, Hero calls $1.07.

Turn: ($4.43) 8:c (3 players)
UTG2 checks, Hero checks, BU raises to $3.55, UTG2 calls $1.08(All-In), Hero calls $2.73.

River: ($11.79) 8:h (3 players)

Final Pot: $11.79.
Results follow:

Hero shows a pair of eights(7:s K:s).
BU shows a full-house, nines full of eights(9:c 9:s).
UTG2 shows a full-house, threes full of eights(3:d 3:h).

BU wins with a full-house, nines full of eights(9:c 9:s).


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10 replies
veriz
Joined: 20.07.2008

Hello Holidej,

Preflop: Fold preflop!

As played
Postflop: Rather fold on flop while being OOP and in such a multiway pot. :) Especially when you are going to make such mistakes on the turn. Pretty bad play. :(

Best Regards.


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I suggest to read the articles here...


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Holidej
Joined: 03.05.2011

Can you give me wider explanation? Why is call on turn big mistake if pot odds are 3:1, and I have odds 2:1?


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slipkn6t
Joined: 27.06.2011

Originally posted by Holidej
Can you give me wider explanation? Why is call on turn big mistake if pot odds are 3:1, and I have odds 2:1?

If you go allin on a flop with a flushdraw you will hit it 1 out of 3 times on average. But in your example you are not on the flop anymore, you are on turn. And your odds on turn are worse since you only have 1 card to come. It's 9 (the number of :spade: cards left) / 46 (the number of cards we haven't seen in this hand yet) = 0,1956521739130435 => you hit your flush 1 out of 5 times on average if you go allin on turn with a flushdraw.


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Holidej
Joined: 03.05.2011

Slipkn6t you are forgetting one thing, on turn I have flash draw+ gutshot. ;) But my calculation error, I thought that I have odds 2:1 on turn, while actually they were 3:1. :f_cry: I see mistake now.


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slipkn6t
Joined: 27.06.2011

Originally posted by Holidej
Slipkn6t you are forgetting one thing, on turn I have flash draw+ gutshot. ;) But my calculation error, I thought that I have odds 2:1 on turn, while actually they were 3:1. :f_cry: I see mistake now.

ok 13 (4 gutshot + 9 flushdraw) / 46 = 0.2826086956521739 => 1 out of 3.5.


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Board: 3♠J♠9♥
       Equity     Win     Tie
MP2    29.00%  29.00%   0.00% { Ks7s }
MP3    66.45%  66.45%   0.00% { 9s9c }
CO      4.55%   4.55%   0.00% { 3d3h }

Seems like you have 3.4:1 odds here and pot odds are 3.1:1 on flop.

But on turn:

Board: 3♠J♠9♥ 8♣
       Equity     Win     Tie
MP2    23.81%  23.81%   0.00% { Ks7s }
MP3    73.80%  73.80%   0.00% { 9s9c }
CO      2.39%   2.39%   0.00% { 3d3h }

You have 4.3:1 and pot odds are 3:1

To Slipkn6t:
Gutshot+FD is 12 outs... :megusta:


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slipkn6t
Joined: 27.06.2011

Originally posted by Karl0zzz
To Slipkn6t:
Gutshot+FD is 12 outs... :megusta: why don't you explain it instead of just saying? Like this:
1 gutshot out = FD out because it's the same card. And that's why GS+FD has 12 outs not 13.
It took me like 2 minutes to understand this, you could save my time by explaining it yourself


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Originally posted by slipkn6t

Originally posted by Karl0zzz
To Slipkn6t:
Gutshot+FD is 12 outs... :megusta: why don't you explain it instead of just saying? Like this:
1 gutshot out = FD out because it's the same card. And that's why GS+FD has 12 outs not 13.
It took me like 2 minutes to understand this, you could save my time by explaining it yourself

At Least now you know and understand it, because you figured it out yourself..:)


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veriz
Joined: 20.07.2008

Originally posted by Holidej
Can you give me wider explanation? Why is call on turn big mistake if pot odds are 3:1, and I have odds 2:1?

Well, because you could be against straight? You could be against set? You have to discount outs and you ain't getting then the correct odds?


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