SH Zoom QQ BB vs CO

Hi,

Funny spot actually. I think he has TT in his range, but could he do this with hands like AKdd/AJdd/KJdd or so? even with 89dd? If so, I think we could even 3-bet and go with this hand. The other option is to call flop and call-down on safer cards, or even ch/shove blank turn.

I think villain will have some suited stuff, so you can call.

.

Originally posted by IPtkv
If he is unknown why not 3 betting more OOP for value 8,9bb is good. On the flop he is raising you 2.5x on wet board, which looks weak. And as you said you can check/shove safe turn.

I think 3-betting 8-9 bb versus min open is a mistake, especially if you do it only with good hands. Regs will see how you play better hands and then they can always steal with min-raise, whether they had Q9o or AA. Everytime you 3-bet and they have crap, they can easily fold after losing only 2bb. And if they have AA they can play it strong!

About your flop comment.. It's not actually that wet at all - there's only diamonds draw that makes sense here on NL5. On higher stakes this could be a bit more wet board as people might bluff-raise with 89 here as well.

If it's zoom or rush, they wount notice you bet/raise sizing for sure. As far as Ive seen they are stacking off really light..

Two weeks ago I would 3bet/call shove on the flop or call at least, but then I was getting alot of advice that people at this limit have it more often than not when doing those raises and I should mostly fold when they show aggression. So, I started to act according to those and I think they were right! Since it's a 3bet pot vs unknown player, I don't expect him to raise any bluffs or semi bluffs. There is a chance that he is value raising AT or JJ, but it's really not that likelly, imo. I expect him to fold A-high and call any draw, probably, maybe even some backdoors with A-high. So, even if the raise was smaller, I believe it's safest to fold and move on. Call would be an option, but I don't feel confortable check/calling or check/shoving the turn, even on 8♠:.

Originally posted by SirPaulius
If it's zoom or rush, they wount notice you bet/raise sizing for sure. As far as Ive seen they are stacking off really light..

I might be an exception there then :f_biggrin:. But to be honest, regulars mostly notice if someones going with bigger 3-bets or open-raises than normally. Like if someone opens 4-5bb, they are not 3-betting that light. And if someone 3-bets like 0.50 versus 0.12 open-raise, they will have way tighter calling range. Against "fishes" you don't have to balance at all, of course

Originally posted by Alleen86
Two weeks ago I would 3bet/call shove on the flop or call at least, but then I was getting alot of advice that people at this limit have it more often than not when doing those raises and I should mostly fold when they show aggression. So, I started to act according to those and I think they were right! Since it's a 3bet pot vs unknown player, I don't expect him to raise any bluffs or semi bluffs. There is a chance that he is value raising AT or JJ, but it's really not that likelly, imo. I expect him to fold A-high and call any draw, probably, maybe even some backdoors with A-high. So, even if the raise was smaller, I believe it's safest to fold and move on. Call would be an option, but I don't feel confortable check/calling or check/shoving the turn, even on 8♠:.

That's actually quite reasonable. Folding is always neutral EV on spots like these, and against unknowns we can't make too many assumptions other than that "he has it". It's a marginal spot anyway, and as I think you have some advantage playing post-flop, you can make higher profits with less variance by giving up these spots.:f_drink::f_drink::f_drink::f_drink::f_drink:

Originally posted by CPallo

Originally posted by SirPaulius
If it's zoom or rush, they wount notice you bet/raise sizing for sure. As far as Ive seen they are stacking off really light..

I might be an exception there then :f_biggrin:. But to be honest, regulars mostly notice if someones going with bigger 3-bets or open-raises than normally. Like if someone opens 4-5bb, they are not 3-betting that light. And if someone 3-bets like 0.50 versus 0.12 open-raise, they will have way tighter calling range. Against "fishes" you don't have to balance at all, of course

I agree. I also notice when someone is making bigger open raises or bigger 3 bets. And even in zoom formats you acquire enough info on tendencies.

Originally posted by nitrol

Originally posted by CPallo

Originally posted by SirPaulius
If it's zoom or rush, they wount notice you bet/raise sizing for sure. As far as Ive seen they are stacking off really light..

I might be an exception there then :f_biggrin:. But to be honest, regulars mostly notice if someones going with bigger 3-bets or open-raises than normally. Like if someone opens 4-5bb, they are not 3-betting that light. And if someone 3-bets like 0.50 versus 0.12 open-raise, they will have way tighter calling range. Against "fishes" you don't have to balance at all, of course

I agree. I also notice when someone is making bigger open raises or bigger 3 bets. And even in zoom formats you acquire enough info on tendencies.

What I meant to say there is no matter if you raise 2x or 3x, cbet 40 or 50%, 3b 2.5x or 3x. OFC anything out of the line will indicate reads.

Its more like a cut off steal,good big blind defender,Thers a lot against you k k kA etc,flush draw set,???? fold it,??
I had same but couldnt post it.

JAs BIG BLIND ,DEFEND.
FLOP 3 3 J
RAISE 10*CALLED ALL IN
I FOLD
SO I STILL WOUNDER IFF HE HAD THE SAME

Bigger 3bet preflop and we should not fold the flop.

What do you think about this range of villain on flop?

JJ-TT,66,22,AdAh,AhAs,ATs,AdQd,AdJd,Ad9d,Ad8d,Ad7d,Ad6d,Ad3d,Ad2d. Assuming he is bluff 4betting A5s and A4s.

Originally posted by VaskataBuci
Bigger 3bet preflop and we should not fold the flop.

What do you think about this range of villain on flop?

JJ-TT,66,22,AdAh,AhAs,ATs,AdQd,AdJd,Ad9d,Ad8d,Ad7d,Ad6d,Ad3d,Ad2d. Assuming he is bluff 4betting A5s and A4s.

I don't think he would call the preflop 3bet with 22, A9s-A2s. He would also 4bet all aces, most likelly. Since it's a 3bet pot, I believe he would rather call his draws on the flop. But we can just speculate, since he is unknown.

I think it would be more like this: TT,66,ATs,AdJd,9d8d,8d7d,7d6d

Because of the small 3bet he has good odds to set mine and probably would call all PP plus many suited hands. I included 2 combos AA because he is unknown, but it does not change much. Even if you think he does not have AA in his range you should be more inclined to stay in the hand. I would re-raise him. There are players who make such plays on low board with their whole calling range preflop. If you fold only AK combos their raise could be profitable. They could do this also with any Ad.