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Making it to the final table in MTTs

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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

Live TN 25 Novembre
20th of 66 players
9 places paid

I missed a rebound shove
CO or 3.5*. He is a quite loose guy and had about 25bb.

I was BB with 11 bb and had TT.
I wanted to shove and then he told me: if you shove I will call you.

So I deducted that his hand was quite good. And finally I folded.

I checked it in ICMizer and it had to be a SHOVE.

With 11bb BB you shove after an openraise :
99+
AK
AQs

He showed me A7s and I had 68% equity against that hand.


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

Things that went well:

1 Iso with AJ with good betsize
2 4bet my QQ when BB sqeeses. Good betsize
3 Iso with QQ with good betsize
4 Shove with KTo 8bb CO


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Information is king, playing a centralized game, centralized spots happens 99% of the time. For example, three betting light pre-flop, when this was first discovered most good players did not know how to handle the moment, thus, this was an effective strategy.

Until what?

Until people became familiar, used to seeing this happen, thus, it is now centralized in the majority of players.

The same way videos are comprehended by how they are followed it is already centralized in most players’ games.

Centralized play is a red target, un-centralized play are the peripheral spots away from the target.

Most players will be uncomfortable in these areas in which they do not know the outcome because it being so rare in their game they will become automatic to pressure then release or make a bigger potential mistake.

Discovering extra information outside the central areas of a person’s game will allow them to make pre-flop moves then barreling a river bet with a runner runner straight board by shoving on the river, however, most players see this happen, but will they call this situation with A high or one pair to beat this type of bluff play?

Knowing what players that will play with a central play philosophy, with hands that play themselves, but how do they play when not in this central zone?

Is this easier or harder to read once a player A understands players B range of central play, in which they understand where their value of their game begins and ends?

Would this be the other part the other side of the coin of a video?

How would one build a ship, a vessel to play within non-central situations when it matters the most, perhaps a final table?

I look for non-academic spots meaning situations that are not seen by a player because they are used to academic situations of known truths that are most discussed and most have seen.

The others come to fruition by putting myself into the fire emotionally, to play the hand, the player how it needs to be played, thus, knowing this about your final table players already needs to be known.

When not known, then a model of playing then finding out the information when the bets are small is a good start, but do the good players already know this as well?

For me videos are a good source of information to emulate, but how much further can a person’s game take the academics of poker, the central parts of an opponent’s game to non-central spots to then exploit?

Thus, the philosophy of poker begins for me to figure out these non-central spots based on as many images, styles, to help with isolation, multi-way spots to exploit the entire table broke down to individual moves against their governed dynamics.

This is what I am currently trying to discover, in ways my opponents are not knowing, or using, when the final tables are in question on who is going to beat who at any given time.

I am developing as many models, strategies to play off of my own models, adding, and subtracting information to develop my own unique style. This to better serve my game when making final tables.

When people are just playing pre-flop poker they are minimizing their winning, thus, a sub-optimal strategy, and unconventional styles become winners because most do not venture into what is uncomfortable in moments when the game means the most.

I always venture into blogs such as these because this information allows for my game to understand deeper the central thinking of good players, your blog is well written and interesting I will continue to read your posts. Good luck.


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

Next week I will play a live TAG-TEAM TN so I restarted practicing with ICMizer. And learning shove-ranges again. If you don't practice with this stuff, it goes to the back of your memory.
So dear braincells: back to work :f_biggrin:


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid

ICMizer with the Calculate-function

I am in Button with 12bb
9 players left, average stack is 14bb

1st situation: Sb has 25bb and BB has 12bb

If it is folded to me, I shove 76%.
All pocketpairs
All Aces, Kings and Queens
All suited Jacks, Tens and 9's

Suited 8's with 4-kicker+
Suited 7's, 6's, 5's and 4 with 3-kicker+

Offsuited Jacks, Tens, 9's, 8's, 7's, 6 with 5-kicker+


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

I repeated a tutorial of ICMizer. With the Nash-Equilibrium-button ICMizer fills in all the percentages of calling/pushing of the players that are behind you.
The Nash-Equilibrium is very helpful for TN and shortstack-situations. Not so much for deepstack-situations.
The CALL-percentages in case Hero PUSHES are the most important.
You can still manually adapt them, in case your table is much different than NASH. For example if there are a lot of loose callingstations behind you.
These CALL-percentages have a very BIG EFFECT on the results of the CALCULATE-function.

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid

ICMizer, first push NASH-button and then Calculate-button

I am in Button with 12bb
9 players left, average stack is 14bb

1st situation: Sb has 25bb and BB has 12bb
MP 12bb openraises to 3bb

We push 9,4%
TT+
AK AQ AJs
KQ KJs KTs
QJs

MP 12 bb openlimps
Not much difference, we can push a bit wider 14,3%
JJ+
AK AQ AJ ATs
KQ KJ KTs
QJs


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
9 players left, average stack is 14bb

I am UTG with 12bb

NASH SHOVE 12%
77+
AJ+
A3s+
KTs+
KQo
QJs

Calculate SHOVE 11%
TT+
AJ+
ATs
KQs


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
9 players left, average stack is 14bb

I am UTG+1 with 12bb
A big stack with 25bb is sitting behind me.

NASH SHOVE 14%
55+
AT+
A3s+
KQo
KTs+
QJs

Calculate SHOVE
88+
AJ+
ATs
KQs
QJs

Beware that the ranges that I take from the Calculate-results are only the hands that have about 0,10% EV. I do this, because in our games the players call looser than Nash.

So UTG+1 is not much difference with UTG. It is just a little bit wider.


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
9 players left, average stack is 14bb
Chips in play 125 bb

I am BTN with 8bb

I am learning that it is incredible important to know exactly the stacksizes before and after you. Depending on them, the results in ICMizer vary enormously.
So from now on, I will exactly indicate how the stacks are distributed, because that is the way how you have to imprint all these SHOVEpercentages in your mind.

UTG 12.5 bb
UTG+1 3.25 bb
MP 7.75 bb

LoJack 37.5 bb
HiJack 12.25 bb
CO 8.75 bb
BTN HERO 8bb

SB 25 bb
BB 10bb

NASH PUSH 37%
22+
All Aces
K4s+
K7o+
Q6s+
QTo+
J6s+
J9o+
T9o
97s+
86s+
76s
65s

NASH gives the big 25bb stack in SB a CALL-percentage of 22%
and the more average 10bb stack in BB a CALL-percentage of 18%.

CALCULATE +0.10EV 27%
22+
All Aces
K9s+
KTo+
Q9s+
QJo
J9s+
T9s

I think for live play it is most practical to learn the CALCULATE +0.10EV-ranges and apply them at the tables.
Learn to widen or tighten up your ranges depending on what types of players you have behind you.


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
9 players left, average stack is 14bb
Chips in play 125 bb

I am MP with 8bb

NASH PUSH 18%

My OpenShove range will be:
CALCULATE +0.10EV 10%
66+
A9s+
ATo+
KQs
KJs
QJs

Tomorrow another calculation and then off to the tournament to take it down :f_p: :f_biggrin:


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
9 players left, average stack is 14bb
Chips in play 125 bb

I am BTN with 8bb

the player in MP 8bb OPEN-SHOVES

NASH CALL-SHOVE 5,4%
99+
AK AQ
AJs

CALCULATE CALL-SHOVE +0.10EV 5,1%
99+
AK AQ

Stackdistribution
UTG 12,5 bb
UTG+1 3.25 bb
MP 7.75 bb
LoJack 37.5 bb
HiJack 12.25 bb
CO 8.75 bb
BTN HERO 8 bb
SB 25 bb
BB 10bb

Guys, I have studied quite some ICMizer this week, so I am well prepared for the TN, I wish myself goodluck at the tables :f_p: :f_tongue: :f_biggrin:


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

Unfortunately it was a TAG TN and my partner didn't study and was too loose.
We had an above average stack at level 5, but 40% of it was spewed with a mediocre hand. :f_mad:

So we only arrived at 49 of 90 players.
Final hand
All in HiJack 11bb AQ. Correct shove.
Being called by KQs CO.
Our equity was 70%.
Unfortunately K on turn and we were out.
Probably I won't play a TAG TN with this partner anymore, because of the skill difference. If I will ever play a TAG TN again, I will choose a partner that is really working on his skills.

Always remember

You can win if you want, if you want it you can win...

Hi Fikret, welcome at my blog, let's jump to the real TN circuit man...:f_biggrin:


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

New week, new calculations and new opportunities.

This week I will make calculations when there are still 24 players at 3 tables.
13 paid places. So it is still 11 players until the bubble.

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am UTG with 12bb

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 14%

44+
AJ+
A7s+ A5s A4s A3s
K9s+
KQo
QJs QTs
JTs

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10EV 10%
99+
AK AQ

Stackdistribution
UTG HERO 12bb
UTG+1 32.5bb
MP 32.5bb
HiJack 12.5bb
CO 60bb
BTN 32.5bb
SB 32.5bb
BB 32.5bb

I am learning the ranges where I have +0.10%EV.
So when we are still quite some time away from the bubble, open-shove tight UTG. No need to shove your medium pockets like 66, 77 and 88.
Neither your Aces with 3rdkicker or less.


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

Erratum yesterday: it is 5,1% instead of 10%
CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10EV 5,1%
99+
AK AQ

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am UTG+1 with 12bb

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 18%
22+
AT+
A2s+
K9s+
KQo KJo
Q9s+
JTs J9s
T9s

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10EV 5.4%
99+
AK AQ
AJs

Stackdistribution
UTG 32.5bb
UTG+1 HERO 12bb
MP 32.5bb
HiJack 12.5bb
CO 60bb
BTN 32.5bb
SB 32.5bb
BB 32.5bb

So 1 place further on the table only adds AJs in our OPEN-SHOVE range +0.10%EV.
Don't shove medium hands in this stage in this early position.


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am LoJack with 12bb

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 19%
22+
AT+
A2s+
K8s+
KQo KJo
QJo
Q9s+
JTs J9s
T9s

Only K8s and QJo are added

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10EV 6,8%
88+
AK AQ AJ

Only 88 and AJo are added.

Stackdistribution
UTG 32.5bb
UTG+1 32.5bb
HERO LoJack 12bb
HiJack 12.5bb
CO 60bb
BTN 32.5bb
SB 32.5bb
BB 32.5bb


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am HiJack with 12bb

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 25%
22+
A8+
A2s+
K7s+
KQo KJo KTo
QJo QTo
Q8s+
JTs J9s J8s
JTo
T9s T8s
98s

So all BrBr

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10EV 7.8%

77+
AK AQ AJ
ATs
KQs

Only 77 , ATs and KQs are added.

Stackdistribution
UTG 32.5bb
UTG+1 32.5bb
LoJack 32.5bb
HERO HiJack 12bb
CO 12.5bb
BTN 60bb
SB 32.5bb
BB 32.5bb


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am CO with 12bb

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 32%
22+
A3o+
A2s+
K5s+
KQo KJo KTo
QJo QTo
Q8s+
JTs J9s J8s
JTo
T9s T8s T7s
98s 97s
87s
76s

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10%EV 10%

55+
AK AQ AJ AT
A9s
KQs

55, 66 , ATo and A9s are added.
:f_wink: :f_pleased:

Notice that there is always a big difference between NASH and CALCULATE +0.10%EV.

NASH is the theory and for me CALCULATE is the practice in liveTN, because my opponents don't play NASH.

Stackdistribution
UTG 32.5bb
UTG+1 32.5bb
LoJack 32.5bb
HiJack 32.5bb
HERO CO 12bb
BTN 12.5bb
SB 60bb
BB 32.5bb


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am BTN with 12bb

SB is equal stack
BB is bigstack

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 38%
22+
All Aces
K3s+
K9o+
QTo+
Q6s+
J7s+
J9o+
T7s+
T9o
98s 97s 96s
87s 86s
76s
65s

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10%EV 16,6%

33+
A7o+
A2s+
KQ
KJs

33, 44, A7o, A8o, A9o, KQo and KJs are added.

So with this stackdistribution I open-shove on the BTN much tighter than I assumed. Next week I will calculate how the openshove range changes if there are average stacks in the blinds.
I think in that situation I will openshove much wider.

Stackdistribution
UTG 32.5bb
UTG+1 32.5bb
LoJack 32.5bb
HiJack 32.5bb
CO 32.5bb
HERO BTN 12bb
SB 12.5bb
BB 60bb


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am SB with 12bb

BB is equal stack

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 67%
22+
All Aces
K3s+
K7o+
Q5o+
Q2s+
J2s+
J7o+
T2s+
T7o+
93s+
96o+
84s+
86o+
74s+
76o
63s+
65o
53s+
43s

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10%EV 33%

22+
All Aces
K3s+
K7o+
Q9s+
QTo
JTs
T9s

So with 12bb in SB and BB is equal stack, only shove about 1/3 of hands.
ICMizer gives BB a call-percentage of 38%, so we will get about 62% of the times a fold.
Lowest suited-connector combo that you shove is T9s. This combo has exactly +0.10%EV in this stack-distribution.
Don't shove 98s, 87s and lower, because they don't have enough %EV.

Stackdistribution
UTG 60bb
UTG+1 32.5bb
LoJack 32.5bb
HiJack 32.5bb
CO 32.5bb
BTN 32.5bb
HERO SB 12bb
BB 12.5bb


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adelaar Topic starter
adelaar
Joined: 25.10.2013
Oldschool Grinder

MTT 90 players, 13 places paid
24 players left, average stack is 33bb
Chips in play 800 bb

I am SB with 12bb

I have changed the stackdistribution.
BB is now average stack.
The equal stack I have moved to HiJack.

I expected more foldequity and a wider shove-range.
But ICMizer gives BB exactly the same callpercentage of 38%.

NASH becomes just a little bit tighter, 3% less. Don't push 65o, T2s, 93s and 96o.

CALCULATE +0.10%EV also a bit tighter, don't shove K3s, K7o and T9s.

NASH OPEN-SHOVE 64%
22+
All Aces
All Kings
Q5o+
Q2s+
J2s+
J7o+
T3s+
T7o+
94s+
97o+
84s+
86o+
74s+
76o
63s+
53s+
43s

CALCULATE OPEN-SHOVE +0.10%EV 31%

22+
All Aces
K4s+
K8o+
Q9s+
QTo
JTs

Stackdistribution
UTG 60bb
UTG+1 32.5bb
LoJack 32.5bb
HiJack 12.5bb
CO 32.5bb
BTN 32.5bb
HERO SB 12bb
BB 32.5bb Average Stack


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